A question for Experienced Fila owners

[Rugers-Kris]

I was just checking out a few things on facebook (I have several Fila based facebook pages on my friends list) and was looking at some pictures of a Specialty show. There are people complaining about a judge that didn't score a Fila high enough (even excluded it completely) because he would not allow himself to be touched and there are some comments about a dog or two that doesn't look at all like a Fila but apparently got "scored" pretty high. Then there was a comment about a judge (Might have been the same one from the earlier complaint) that continued to get "too close" to the Fila's and how they were dissapointed that she was picked to be a judge. I found it all very interesting to read and see but my biggest question is ......How did she walk away unscathed? I have been researching the Fila for quite some time and believe that I have learned A LOT and as most of you know it is my dream to own a Fila and I have even went as far as finding THE Fila male that I would someday like to have a puppy from (Hopefully, that will actually happen) but either way, I do know what I am looking for in a Fila and will definitely own one within the next couple of years. One of the things that I find so interesting about thee Fila is it's dislike for people outside of his immediate family. I find that to be oe of the most impressive things about this breed. The dedication to HIS people and his unmovable desire to protect them. Anyyway, looking at these pictures just kinda threw me off a bit. If had a Fila, I would consider that Fila a "knock off" or "fake" if he allowed strangers to walk right up to him/us and chat.

My question is: Do any of you actually think that it is ok for a Fila (Even those of softer temperment) to allow such a thing? Would you consider this (Under any circumstances) correct?

Personally, I would not. I so admire the Fila and am a bit obsessed with the breed to be honest but this is not what I believe to be a "Fila".

Just curious.

 

[aceoutdoor]

A judge should never touch a Fila period, if they do it shows their lack of knowledge of the dogs they are supposed to be judging. Some Filas are more restrained than others in regards to this and some trust their owners judgement more than others. I muzzle my dogs when taking them to the vet, but I have a male when he sees the syringe come out he lunges. I have a female who is a complete alpha in every way but I tell her to be good and she takes shots no problem. On the other hand if she heard my code word to go, she would take down anything instantly. It is better to have a restrained dog that listens to you, and that in no way means they will not do their job when it needs to be done.

BTW is that your dog in your avatar? Huge!

 

[Rugers-Kris]

I guess it just surprised me that they were standing and chatting....The judge, obviously a complete stranger is standing close enough to pet the dog. I understand restrained but no reaction at all from the dog seems like a red flag to me. He isn't even paying attention which I would think a Fila would be. His isn't a Fila that has the look that I find attractive BUT he also doesn't have the temperment that I would find desirable, either. There was a note that the judge "was lucky he had been neutured". That seems a silly statement to me. Am I that far off?

Yep, That is my Baby, Ruger. He is getting pretty big. He was 162 pounds and 32 inches a couple of months ago and I weigh him and measure him again this weekend as his 1 year Birthday is Monday.

Here is the picture that can be clicked on to see it better.

 

[aceoutdoor]

Your right. The dog should show obvious concern a stranger is so close and should keep his eyes on him until he leaves the area. There are dogs on both sides that have weak drive and temperament and so long as there are people breeding soley for profit that will continue.

Great looking dog BTW.

 

[Rugers-Kris]

The dog that won quite a few "aspects" doesn't even look like a Fila ......I am attaching a couple photos that I pulled. That is the "close" phot that threw me off.

And the winner was

Which doesn't even look like a Fila. Thanks for the compliment on Ruger. He is something else.

Your right. The dog should show obvious concern a stranger is so close and should keep his eyes on him until he leaves the area. There are dogs on both sides that have weak drive and temperament and so long as there are people breeding soley for profit that will continue.

Great looking dog BTW.

 

[Rugers-Kris]

Also, is neuturing supposed to change a Fila?

 

[aceoutdoor]

Both brindles in the first picture appear to be CBKC dogs and the Fawn winner a Cafib dog. Dog shows are great for looking at dogs, but a terrible place to pick a breeder based on show results. In all honesty Fila shows are generally a joke and are more political than anything. I am never shocked to see the dogs that win alot of these shows and the owners and organizers anger when you point out glaring faults in that dog like v lips or flat/decling top lines. If Slim is on here he could discuss his experience at the STL Cafib show years ago when he pointed out a few things.

Neutered Filas tend to maintain their temp.


Perfect pic of a "crooked tail" on that brindle in the backround.

 

[Rugers-Kris]

At this point I am not arguing CAFIB VS. CBKC, I am just curious about the dogs in general. It is my opinion that the brindle dog should have never let that judge get that close to begin with and that the dog that doesn't even look like a Fila certainly shouldn't have won anything. Having read through the "Garb" and "Arguments", neither one of these dogs are CAFIB (At least from what the owners and arguers are saying) but that isn't my point. I was just comepletely surprised at some of this. I was also curious about the owner of the brindle saying "She was lucky he was neutured because in all of the reading I have done (And I have done A LOT) I haven't heard anything about that.

 

[aceoutdoor]

No arguing here. That fawn is bred by a very nice lady named Dianne. She has alot of Cafib blood in her program and openly supports that org. The brindles are clearly the other type and I agree that judge is too close for comfort.

 

[Rugers-Kris]

I think I am missing something (which could be the case) This dog that I am looking at which is a De La Luna dog is a CAFIB dog? Are we talking about the same thing? Researching I have found that a dog would have to be taken to (When age appropriate) an annual CAFIB show to be seen and essentially "certified" as a CAFIB dog. Is that what you are talking about? Not that this was supposed to be a thread on that but it seems inevitable around here. LOL And now you have me wondering again.

 

[aceoutdoor]

Correct De La Luna is known in the Fila community as a Cafib breeder although I believe she has some of both types. Cafib certification has nothing to do with any show except the ones they organize which in the US and is held only once a year I believe. And as nice of a lady and great caretaker of her dogs she is, that dog has no business winning any show.

 

[Rugers-Kris]

That might be where the misunderstanding is as I don't see CAFIB as a type so much as a "certification", I guess. I know there is only one annual CAFIB Certification "show" and I intend to attend it this year. Yes, she does have both types as I have followed her a bit as well as many other breeders to see if I could find what I was looking for. I guess I don't consider a breeder one or the other if they breed both "types". I can't imagine they can be a CAFIB breeder if they are breeding both types and mixing the two...At least that is my opnion. Either way, I certainly agree that dog had no business winning the show or even being there to represent this breed. I have been researching breeder and owners and Fila lovers as I go. I am following them in forums, on blogs, facebook, kennel sites....anywhere I can get a chance to check them out. I find the forums and blogs are the best place as they are more relaxed and talk more openly allowing me to "learn" a bit more. I have also ordered and read many books on the breed (OneI actually had to translate LOL) and I welcomeany new information oropinions as I go. I was just really wondering if anyone who owns/works with Filas would agree that you could have a correct Fila if a judge could get that close without issue and I was shocked at the skinny dog that was sopopular at the show and just wanted some insight. I appreciate you taking them time to talk it over with me and hopefully more will chime in regardless of which "type" they support.

 

[chuckorlando]

I dont think a fila needs to be a mindless beast. I believe a well balanced dog can read their owners to a great extent. I could never allow anyone that close to Kona. Not that she woud'nt sit and be pretty ok, but theres a very very high chance she will bite you that close. Even if all seems ok to us, she will likely find a fault in you. But a few more feet back, if I walk up to you, she is ussua;y ok. If you walk up to us, it's gonna be some shit though

I dot think any fila should be touched. Even super soft ones.

 

[Tiger12490]

saw those pics on facebook also gonna be honest I dont like the way the winner looked really racy even as Cafib fila go...but hey thats why im not a judge..and if that was Athena that judge would be missing a limb very important to her

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I317 using Tapatalk 2

 

[aceoutdoor]

Cafib is basically just a club. They do not register or paper dogs. They are also considered a type of Fila, a type that just like the other type has quite a variation in conformation within that type as seen by the winner of that show as well as another Cafib dog at that show. There are 2 Cafib breeders in the US (one is Juan) that have desirable looking and well temped dogs. The rest of the Cafib dogs in the US that I have encountered are very undesirable and unattractive. As far as I am concerned the best Cafib dogs are in South America. CBKC is a registry for dogs bred inside Brazil, Filas bred outside Brazil typically are registered with FCI or a local affiliate. CBKC is also considered a type. There is also variation in conformation within this type. In my opinion the best CBKC breeders are in the US and Mexico although there are a few in South America who are at the top of my list. The official internationally recognized standard is the FCI/CBKC standard and it is not perfect. Neither standard recognizes dogs with alot of white which is wrong because that is a well documented look that has been around a long time.


Rugers-Kris Did you see the Itanhandu dog at that show? Does that look like a fila to you?

 

[Rugers-Kris]

I don't expect them to mindless beasts either but they shouldn't be comfortable with just anyone walking up to them. I agree they should trust thier owners but at the very minimum I would think that they would be very alert. Also, it doesn't seem to be a nice conversation in the photo.If I can see tension in the photo, I would think a Fila would sense it, ya know? No they shouldn't be touched, Hell that is even written into the standard, right? I don't know.....I was just observing and figured I would throw it out there. I am so obsessed with this breed, I try to catch everything I can about them.

I dont think a fila needs to be a mindless beast. I believe a well balanced dog can read their owners to a great extent. I could never allow anyone that close to Kona. Not that she woud'nt sit and be pretty ok, but theres a very very high chance she will bite you that close. Even if all seems ok to us, she will likely find a fault in you. But a few more feet back, if I walk up to you, she is ussua;y ok. If you walk up to us, it's gonna be some shit though

I dot think any fila should be touched. Even super soft ones.

---------- Post added at 10:43 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:41 PM ----------

I didn't see the Itanhandu dog, do you have a photo? I was just persuing facebook so only had the option to see what others had posted.

Cafib is basically just a club. They do not register or paper dogs. They are also considered a type of Fila, a type that just like the other type has quite a variation in conformation within that type as seen by the winner of that show as well as another Cafib dog at that show. There are 2 Cafib breeders in the US (one is Juan) that have desirable looking and well temped dogs. The rest of the Cafib dogs in the US that I have encountered are very undesirable and unattractive. As far as I am concerned the best Cafib dogs are in South America. CBKC is a registry for dogs bred inside Brazil, Filas bred outside Brazil typically are registered with FCI or a local affiliate. CBKC is also considered a type. There is also variation in conformation within this type. In my opinion the best CBKC breeders are in the US and Mexico although there are a few in South America who are at the top of my list. The official internationally recognized standard is the FCI/CBKC standard and it is not perfect. Neither standard recognizes dogs with alot of white which is wrong because that is a well documented look that has been around a long time.


Rugers-Kris Did you see the Itanhandu dog at that show? Does that look like a fila to you?

 

[Rugers-Kris]

I didn't see the Itanhandu dog, do you have a photo? I was just persuing facebook so only had the option to see what others had posted.

Cafib is basically just a club. They do not register or paper dogs. They are also considered a type of Fila, a type that just like the other type has quite a variation in conformation within that type as seen by the winner of that show as well as another Cafib dog at that show. There are 2 Cafib breeders in the US (one is Juan) that have desirable looking and well temped dogs. The rest of the Cafib dogs in the US that I have encountered are very undesirable and unattractive. As far as I am concerned the best Cafib dogs are in South America. CBKC is a registry for dogs bred inside Brazil, Filas bred outside Brazil typically are registered with FCI or a local affiliate. CBKC is also considered a type. There is also variation in conformation within this type. In my opinion the best CBKC breeders are in the US and Mexico although there are a few in South America who are at the top of my list. The official internationally recognized standard is the FCI/CBKC standard and it is not perfect. Neither standard recognizes dogs with alot of white which is wrong because that is a well documented look that has been around a long time.


Rugers-Kris Did you see the Itanhandu dog at that show? Does that look like a fila to you?

 

[Gunny]

Great informative thread. I too am very interested in this breed but it seems there's a lot more to them than other mastiffs, i.e. CAFIB vs. CKBC etc. I'd love to have a dog with the complete opposite disposition towards strangers as Gunny.

I checked out the Itanhandu website, what's up with the elbows of all their males?

 

[aceoutdoor]

 

[Rugers-Kris]

Beautiful coloring on that dog, short of that...I am much less than impressed. Nothing on the pup says "Fila" to me. I have actually looked at thier website and followed them quite a bit in different places and they aren't someone I would consider getting a pup from. I am not trying to put them down, it is just a personal opinion. They were one of the first I looked at because when you do a Fila search, they one of few that come up everytime.