Woman on NYC Train Continued to Push Dog

Discussion in 'Dogs in the News' started by Steven C, Apr 26, 2018.

  1. Steven C

    Steven C Active Member

    Interesting, I did not see the reports from others nearby so I missed that part. I kind of figured the dog went for the foot because that was what she used to hit or kick the dog with. I didn't think the dog showed any signs of aggression in fact I thought the dog did really well until the violence happened.

    Like you said it is speculation, could have went either way.
     
  2. Justin B.

    Justin B. Active Member

    I think you might of quoted the wrong person. I am very familiar with NYC. My Mom and her family are from there. They still live there.
    Ive said multiple times no dogs allowed.
     
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  3. Steven C

    Steven C Active Member

    So you think it may have been a service dog also?

    By the way, there was a post today regarding cherry eye and I thought about the problem zeela was having if you didn't see it, check it out. Talked about removal of the gland or something.
     
  4. Zeela

    Zeela Well-Known Member

    Probably not a service dog.
    Yes, I saw the post, thank you & yes, probably going to have to remove gland. Just want to wait, she is only 10 months old.
     
  5. Boxergirl

    Boxergirl Well-Known Member

    I say probably not a service dog too. I know that one of the first things my daughter's boy was taught was an "under," "tuck," or "middle" cue for when they're in tight spaces. It keeps him from encroaching on other people's space and also helps keep him safe. I think most service animals are taught something similar for travel situations.
     
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  6. Nik

    Nik Well-Known Member

    Oh those are some good commands! You should start a separate thread in the training section about the useful commands taught for service animals. I know I would love some tips on how under, tuck, middle are taught. I can see multiple uses for something like that.
     
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  7. Justin B.

    Justin B. Active Member

    Don't they do pretty diligent temperament testing to make sure service dogs won't snap in tense or agitated situations???

    Are there cases of real service dogs attacking in public?
     
  8. Steven C

    Steven C Active Member

    No. The dog has to meet certain criteria to begin training. While aggression might be one of them, testing to see if a dog bites is not. It also has to do with the type of service, hearing, seeing eye, diabetic, weed holder or whatever.
    Many of those dogs never complete but still during training are certified.

    As far as attacking in public or defending itself or its owner I have no idea but would be interesting to see.
     
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  9. Boxergirl

    Boxergirl Well-Known Member

    Actually, there is no test or certification for a service animal. There are requirements to be met for therapy dogs, which may be what Steven is thinking of. Temperament issues would be something that would wash a service animal from the program. I'm sure there have been instances where a service dog bit, but I don't have any information about that specifically. Most often it's ESAs that you hear about. I would expect that liability would fall on the owner/handler in almost all instances.

    This might be of interest:

    S. Code of Federal Regulations § 36.202(c)(2):

    (2) Exceptions. A public accommodation may ask an individual with a disability to remove a service animal from the premises if:

    (i) The animal is out of control and the animal’s handler does not take effective action to control it; or

    (ii) The animal is not housebroken.

    (3) If an animal is properly excluded. If a public accommodation properly excludes a service animal under § 36.302(c)(2), it shall give the individual with a disability the opportunity to obtain goods, services, and accommodations without having the service animal on the premises.

    Also:
    https://www.ada.gov/regs2010/service_animal_qa.html

    And this bit in particular from the above link -

    "The ADA requires that service animals be under the control of the handler at all times ... Under control also means that a service animal should not be allowed to bark repeatedly in a lecture hall, theater, library, or other quiet place. However, if a dog barks just once, or barks because someone has provoked it, this would not mean that the dog is out of control.
     
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  10. Jarena

    Jarena Well-Known Member

    I second what Nik said! I have googled service dog commands before and I haven’t really found what I’m looking for! Because of your daughters “Otis in training” videos, I started teaching Lettie “tuck” and “under”. A service dog command thread is a great idea!
     
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  11. Boxergirl

    Boxergirl Well-Known Member

    I think a lot of it depends on what each individual chooses. I'm sure that if you're training with an organization they have standardized cues. Owner trained animals have more flexibility. She just texted me that Otis is now retrieving her diabetes emergency kit. Still with prompting, but he's doing really well.

    Nik, my girl's Otis in Training blog is on facebook. She has some videos you might enjoy and she's very approachable if you have a question.
     
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  12. Steven C

    Steven C Active Member


    What if its job was to bark for say a hearing impaired service dog? Or to alert the owner that its time take their meds? I would think barking would be an integral part of service dogs. Some legit service dog companies that provide for the blind or hearing impaired actually get control numbers with sealed certificates noting breed, age, when certified but not for the actual disability, although they are probably not needed according to the ADA.

    Interesting
     
  13. Jarena

    Jarena Well-Known Member

    Ah sometimes I wish your daughter was also on here. She seems to also have a lot of knowledge about dogs. :)
     
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  14. Steven C

    Steven C Active Member


    I just reread that. I see you said Not disqualified. ok cool. I actuallt don't know anything about therapy dogs. I do however know enough about seeing eye and hearing dogs because my friend Paul Bouchard owned ABS guide dogs and helped train an old golden for 2 years. They had dogs worth 30k to 60k amazing dogs with years of training. While in training they were issued control numbers although no idea if federal control numbers or not.
     
  15. Boxergirl

    Boxergirl Well-Known Member

    An already trained dog was going to cost over $25,000. Since my daughter was pursuing her behavior specialty and her training certification, she decided to train her own dog. I'm sure that many organizations do keep strict records of the dogs they train and place, but the ADA doesn't require any certification. Temperament testing is also not required by the ADA. I'm sure that it probably a requirement for individual organizations that train for specific purposes. Individual organizations often have their own rules that aren't necessarily required by federal law, at least that is my understanding. For anyone interested, the link I provided about is the FAQ page from the ADA and has a lot of detailed information.
     
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  16. Boxergirl

    Boxergirl Well-Known Member

    I believe that if the dog was trained to bark as a task that would be allowed. That would be different than barking at people, other animals, or generally being disruptive.
     
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  17. Boxergirl

    Boxergirl Well-Known Member

    She's learning more all the time. I'm very proud of all she has accomplished at a young age. I'm also lucky that I get to learn with her.
     
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  18. Nik

    Nik Well-Known Member

    Can you send a link to the training blog on facebook? :)
     
  19. DennasMom

    DennasMom Well-Known Member

    Last I heard about dogs on the subway, was that non-service dogs had to be in a crate or carrier... even a "small bag" would be ok... which brought out a lot of interesting options... (i.e. they did not define the word "small"... and NewYorkers are a creative bunch!)

    https://www.rover.com/blog/nyc-subway-dogs-fs/
     
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  20. Steven C

    Steven C Active Member

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