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shock collars ?

we just got a trainer for Tazo our 1 yr old Cane Corso. He says we need to get a shock collar for him. my question is...Is that an effective tool for this breed or not?
 

Jadotha

Well-Known Member
^^ What Angelbears said.

I do think shock collars have their valid uses, but I would be concerned that a shock collar would be your trainer's first tool of choice-- especially for such a young dog. Did he explain why?
 

filagiel

Well-Known Member
I'm new to the forum and tried to post a similiar question earlier today. I have a 1 1/2 yr old female Fila that will not stop trying to herd my horses, I have 5 horses and 2 of them will kill a dog.... Thought about purchasing a shock collar but don't if it's the right thing to do? Any ideas?
 

TexasRose

Active Member
The trainer we're working with uses E-collars as well, but only after they're at least 5 months old and for certain issues. We've been having issues with our CC puppy, 15 weeks old, grabbing our daughters clothing and ripping it as she walks around the house. So our trainer is going to come this week and evaluate and see if the collar would be appropriate to use in this situation. He also uses E-collars for working the dogs off-leash. He said that after his obedience training that they're really just an insurance policy so that if the dog is off-leash and gets distracted by something, like where he could run into a street or something unsafe, you can use the e-collar to get his attention back on you. When he came over for our puppy consultation he had us place the collar on our palm and feel the different levels. He mostly uses vibration only with the dogs, only a few require the actual impulses. Personally, I wouldn't do anything with a shock collar without the guidance of a trainer that is experienced in using them.

We're going to explore every other method of dealing with the puppy biting before using the collar but we know how important it is for the puppy to learn that he does not "out-rank" our daughter, so we have to get it to stop asap...
 

Cody

Well-Known Member
I have no issue with an e collar used as a tool, depending on what you are training for. High levels and competitive OB definitely use for distance corrections, recall under distractions...
That said, I would NEVER use an e collar on a pup! Especially a CC pup. They are very owner sensitive, they learn quickly and are eager to please.
Why does your trainer immediately resort to compulsion for training a puppy?
Has he/she worked with the breed before and to what degree?
Even those who train their Corso's for high levels of competition, ring sports and Schutzhund only use positive reward based training to start. The e collar only comes in after maturity.
Making it as fun as possible, making the dog LOVE working.
 
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he sujested we use the shock collar for off leash training, because Tazo is too hard to control while on a reg. leash and has already broke free from leash and killed a sm dog.
 

jamesb

Well-Known Member
he sujested we use the shock collar for off leash training, because Tazo is too hard to control while on a reg. leash and has already broke free from leash and killed a sm dog.

well now there is something that should have been put in the OP. i was about to say that i was personally against them but with that kind of incident, i hope it works out for you and your pooch and i'm curious to know the circumstances surrounding the attack.
 

Cody

Well-Known Member
Wow, ya. Knowing that in the OP would be helpful.
What kind and how much training has he had until now?
I am kinda surprised to be honest, I have met very few truly dog aggressive CC's.
To be blunt here, why is he doing off leash training a all? If he has broken a leash to go after and killed another dog, I personally wouldn't off leash train.
Could we get more info on the incident?
 

Duetsche_Doggen

Well-Known Member
What Cody said if he's hard to control on leash, why let him off? Especially if he killed a small dog. I can't go by much from the post but it sounds like the dog is calling the shots, not sure how a shock collar would help the situation. Depending on how bad the circumstances are it could make the dog worse.
 

angelbears

Well-Known Member
What Cody said if he's hard to control on leash, why let him off? Especially if he killed a small dog. I can't go by much from the post but it sounds like the dog is calling the shots, not sure how a shock collar would help the situation. Depending on how bad the circumstances are it could make the dog worse.

Totally agree! You have to put in the work. Putting a shock collar on an untrained dog is not going to do much good. Most likely you are going to either have a submissive bag of nerves or an out of control maniac. You have to work on the basics, then add the collar to reinforce, if needed. On a giant breed, you should always have a leather leash, nylon pops very easily.
 

Cody

Well-Known Member
Yup, on a high drive dog prong collars as well as e collars can agitate, increasing the levels of drive and aggression.
I would go back to square one. Sounds like the main thing you have to work on is getting your dog to focus on you, to look you in the eye on command and want to work for you. To not care about the distractions around, only what you want from him.
That is building the bond IMO.
 

TexasRose

Active Member
Oh wow. That does paint a better picture. But I agree with what everyone else said, work on the basics. Personally, I wouldn't let him off leash at all if he's already killed a smaller dog because that's a lawsuit waiting to happen.
 

DennasMom

Well-Known Member
I'd second everything Cody said - back to basic attention work first, build the bond with trust and respect in your own home first, then in a training facility, then in public. Go SLOWLY. Be very, very patient. Find the right positive motivation (real cooked chicken was one that worked for me with a previous "bad" dog), before you resort to negative consequences and see if you can turn this guy around.

Listen to what the dog is saying - if it was fear based aggression, the eCollar might make it worse (as it did for our "bad" dog) - especially if you're not an expert in timing the impulses (which I'm sure was one of my problems).

I can see where the trainer may be thinking the leash is "giving the dog power" - a lot of incidents occur on-leash, because the dog feels more protective, and may think it necessary to control the situation when on leash, while off-leash, he may be more relaxed. If you go the eCollar route, be sure you're working in a safe environment for all concerned.

Good luck - and kudos for taking on this challenge!
 

tchvt

Well-Known Member
As a behaviorist and trainer there is NO WAY I would put a ECollar on a puppy. You are dealing with a puppy that is teething and also trying to find his way in the pack. Diverting to an appropriate toy to chew on, immediate correction, or time out if it becomes to rough, these are my suggestions. There must be rules and consequenses when rules are broken, also at this age I hope you have started manners at least the pup needs to work for things. If he just comes up and starts biting for attention to play this can roll into other dominate traits. With the latching onto the clothes and not letting go with pups I have often rolled their lips under their teeth when they become mouthy and they feel how hurtful those teeth are. When pups are with their littermates they learn how hard they can bite by playing with the rest of the litter. If the pup was taken from the litter younger than 9wks sometimes you have to enforce this more. I am a big fan "time outs' if a pup becomes to rowdy, remove him from the situation with the command NO BITE and put in a crate or outside for 5-10 minutes. Being kicked from the pack will truly make a mark in thier mind about what is right and what is wrong. Another thing you can do for distraction is if he gets mouthy is take a empty water bottle with 10 pennies in it and shake it when he gets focused on biting with the command NO BITE again. I would try these before anyone get near a puppy with a ECOLLAR.

I have trained Military dogs to go overseas in the current war effort, police dogs for San Diego , and many working breeds and mastiffs of all variety I have never had to resort to an ecollar, to me when a trainer has to turn to that they really don't know the dog and how to modify the behavior or work with them dog to get them to work effectively so they turn to that