1 yr old Cane Corso - Territorial Aggression, and Aggression with 7-12 month old Pups

[Brewzer]

Hello!

My husband and I love our 110 lb Cane Corso, Brewzer, but he is out of control! He has had territorial aggression with our neighbors since we've had him. Unfortunately, he entered a "fear stage" early, and we tried to calm him when he would give a little puppy growl i.e. "it's okay, Brewzer!". Rather than teaching him it was okay to trust people, we taught him it was okay to growl at them! We've had him in training since he was 6 months old, which has helped a little, but for the most part he's simply made friends with his trainer and improvement outside of training have plateaued. He has also been picking on puppies between six or seven months to one year old at the park. I think he's picking on them because he senses their naivety and age as weakness. He hadn't bitten, but the last two times we've been at the dog park he's actually bitten dogs. He hasn't drawn blood, but I'm worried he will! My main two concerns:

1. Aggression towards strangers (lunging, jumping, and growling ferociously).
2. Biting at the dog park.

My husband and I are VERY strict with him, and are consistent with ensuring we are alpha. He is very good for us, easily submits and allows us to dominate him. However, in these situations we don't have a chance to dominate until he's already shown aggression because things move so quickly. Any suggestions? We are considering a shock collar, and would like to hear thoughts.

Thanks in advance!

 

[irina]

Re: 1 yr old Cane Corso - Territorial Aggression, and Aggression with 7-12 month old

I cannot comment on the territorial agression, but as far as attacking other dogs and puppies, we are going through a similar stage. Ours is almost 2 y o though, but his brother matured very early. So you might be hitting the same stage early. A lot of people and especially mastiff owners do not recommend going to the dog park. We used to go every once in a while, just because he loves to run so much and there is not another area close by where I can let him run off leash legally. We never had a problem, until the last visit when he tried to hump another male dog. The dog did not like it and snapped to tell him to back away. Previously he would always get the message and back off, but this time he rolled the dog and bit it on the leg. He was wearing an e-collar since we have issues with off leash control sometimes. but that did not stop him, since he was running on adrenalin at this point. This was the first time he bit a dog, I am not taking another chance.
In terms of lunging at people, I would work on having him sit and focus on you when people pass. Treat him when he is able to do so, correct when he loses focus.

 

[Brewzer]

Re: 1 yr old Cane Corso - Territorial Aggression, and Aggression with 7-12 month old

I cannot comment on the territorial agression, but as far as attacking other dogs and puppies, we are going through a similar stage. Ours is almost 2 y o though, but his brother matured very early. So you might be hitting the same stage early. A lot of people and especially mastiff owners do not recommend going to the dog park. We used to go every once in a while, just because he loves to run so much and there is not another area close by where I can let him run off leash legally. We never had a problem, until the last visit when he tried to hump another male dog. The dog did not like it and snapped to tell him to back away. Previously he would always get the message and back off, but this time he rolled the dog and bit it on the leg. He was wearing an e-collar since we have issues with off leash control sometimes. but that did not stop him, since he was running on adrenalin at this point. This was the first time he bit a dog, I am not taking another chance.
In terms of lunging at people, I would work on having him sit and focus on you when people p$#@!. Treat him when he is able to do so, correct when he loses focus.

It is very likely he's entering the same stage as your dog early, especially since he entered his first fear stage at 3 months! I'm sorry to hear your dog is having the same issue! We work on having him sit and watch us when we know people are near, but he just runs on what seams like instinct by growling. I'm wondering if the e-collar would help with this. Just getting him to pay attention to us. Using the collar when he is looking at them, and treating when he's looking at us - keeping focused. I think we need to quit the dog parks, too. Sadly. Thanks for the feedback!!

 

[karennj]

Re: 1 yr old Cane Corso - Territorial Aggression, and Aggression with 7-12 month old

using a ecollar when looking at strangers may just make him associate strangers with pain and make him more aggressive towards strangers. Did your trainer come into your home or was it classes? I would also avoid dog parks. They are not for everyone.

 

[BlackShadowCaneCorso]

Re: 1 yr old Cane Corso - Territorial Aggression, and Aggression with 7-12 month old

I would bring in a trainer used to dealing with these situations before things get more dangerous than they have. Ecollars are great for control but when you have a dog that is already running hot you can actually cause them to become more ramped with it, so no I don't suggest the collar. Taking him to dog parks after the first sign of acting like an ass was a bad idea, those areas are hyped up with dogs that are far to "game-on" because they are brought there as a source of exercise instead of being tired out before so they can greet other dogs properly.

 

[season]

Re: 1 yr old Cane Corso - Territorial Aggression, and Aggression with 7-12 month old

You say you're "strict" with him....I'm assuming that's in the house. You also need to hold him accountable outside. Pay attention to triggers. Go for the fuse before waiting for the bomb to go off. By that time you've lost your opportunity. There are so many little things that go into leading your dog. Often time we blame "phases" or call it aggression when in all actuality it's not. It's fear and insecurity. Sounds to me like your dog is not feeling safe when outside. It's protecting you because, perhaps, he doesn't feel protected by you. That's when dogs start getting fearful, anxious and aggressive. Take a look at what you aren't giving your dog and it might lead you to what your dog is giving you.

 

[SG1]

Re: 1 yr old Cane Corso - Territorial Aggression, and Aggression with 7-12 month old

Sombody, anybody please explain to me what the heck is fear aggregation, fear phase fear stage? How can someone identify it from plain fear and plain agregation? How can a dog be both at the same time? Brewzer is just growing up and asserting himself. Remember all of the dogs on this forum were bread to be guardians or hunters. This in turn means the have to take the initiative, they have to attack a stranger and or there prey.

Someone tell me what they think of this example. When I picked up my three month old TM from the cargo area he displayed no fear or aggression towards me or my SO. She held him in her lap for awhile then I held him. An employee in the cargo area came over to pet him. I told her he was not friendly and that he my bite judging from only the breeds reputation. She reached out to pet his head and he did not do a thing. The same woman came back a second time and when she reached out to pet him he tried to take her finger off without any type of warning. She was able to pull her hand back without being bitten. A guy who also worked there came by and wanted to pet him. I warned him
of the incident before he came out. He still reached his hand out to pet him and my three month old TM with no hesitation and no warning tried to take a couple of digits. Like you I thought dispite his reputation he is only three months old and would not do anything. I just told them that so they would not touch him.

Now tell me is that example a case of fear biting or whatever you want to call it or is it
plain old aggression? If you say fear stage, fear aggression how did you make that determination?

Inquiring minds want to know.

 

[Hector]

Re: 1 yr old Cane Corso - Territorial Aggression, and Aggression with 7-12 month old

Sombody, anybody please explain to me what the heck is fear aggregation, fear phase fear stage? How can someone identify it from plain fear and plain agregation? How can a dog be both at the same time? Brewzer is just growing up and asserting himself. Remember all of the dogs on this forum were bread to be guardians or hunters. This in turn means the have to take the initiative, they have to attack a stranger and or there prey.

Someone tell me what they think of this example. When I picked up my three month old TM from the cargo area he displayed no fear or aggression towards me or my SO. She held him in her lap for awhile then I held him. An employee in the cargo area came over to pet him. I told her he was not friendly and that he my bite judging from only the breeds reputation. She reached out to pet his head and he did not do a thing. The same woman came back a second time and when she reached out to pet him he tried to take her finger off without any type of warning. She was able to pull her hand back without being bitten. A guy who also worked there came by and wanted to pet him. I warned him
of the incident before he came out. He still reached his hand out to pet him and my three month old TM with no hesitation and no warning tried to take a couple of digits. Like you I thought dispite his reputation he is only three months old and would not do anything. I just told them that so they would not touch him.

Now tell me is that example a case of fear biting or whatever you want to call it or is it
plain old aggression? If you say fear stage, fear aggression how did you make that determination?

Inquiring minds want to know.

From what you described, that dog has one hell of a temperament. He attacks with no warning means he may have very low thresholds for anything he doesn't like and at 3 months, that's very scary. Usually dogs that are fear biters will do a lot of bluffing/lots of signs. They will back up with forward pressure. They bite with the front teeth. Non-fear biters will bite with a full mouth grip.

Strangers reaching out to pet the head is said to be a dominating move and invasion of space. Reaching to pet a dog instead of letting the dog initiate the interaction is invasive.

 

[SG1]

Re: 1 yr old Cane Corso - Territorial Aggression, and Aggression with 7-12 month old

I understand how that kind of temperament could be scary, even to experienced trainers. I sometimes look at him and think I imported him from the development own kennels. But not to worry he gets along well with my CO and BB as a matter of fact if you were to see him on the street with me you wouldn't even know he had it in him.

Thank you for clearing that up for me, now explain how that describes the dog
brewzer depicted. I did not read any of the behavior you stated in her post.

 

[Hector]

Re: 1 yr old Cane Corso - Territorial Aggression, and Aggression with 7-12 month old

now explain how that describes the dog
brewzer depicted. I did not read any of the behavior you stated in her post.

I'm not understanding what you mean.

 

[BlackShadowCaneCorso]

Re: 1 yr old Cane Corso - Territorial Aggression, and Aggression with 7-12 month old

I believe they mean when Brewzer said that as a puppy when he wasn't comfortable he would growl and they would pet and comfort, reinforcing that the growling at strangers was a correct way to address a situation the puppy wasn't happy with. Fast forward a few months and now we have lunging, growling and generally trying to intimidate others around him. The trainer he made friends with likely was because the trainer didn't allow the behaviour. I don't necessarily think it is fear aggressive if he isn't backing off, I think as a pup it was uncertainty and he had his reaction reinforced so now he believe that his reaction (growling) is acceptable in situations he doesn't want to deal with or to control and has escalated his behaviour.

Dog aggression is not overly odd, especially in dog parks where everyone seems to have dogs that are amped up, that is why I do not advocate them. My dogs are comfortable with their pack, although even in them I have to be there with my two dominant females to keep all in line.

You need to learn your dogs triggers and how to manage them or it will get worse because right now he is controlling the situation and you will just start to avoid them instead of teaching the proper way to address them.

 

[season]

Re: 1 yr old Cane Corso - Territorial Aggression, and Aggression with 7-12 month old

A lot of times ppl mistake "aggression" for fear and nervousness. It sounds like your dog doesn't feel safe with you and your husband as owners/leaders. When I see people say they are "strict" and we are "alpha" have tried to convince themselves that they are when all reality they aren't. When you have authority over your dog it won't act like that. You can take your dog to a "trainer" all you want, but the real work is done at home...it does no good if your dog feels it needs to protect you....it's not the job of the dog to protect you...it's your job to protect your dog.

 

[SG1]

Re: 1 yr old Cane Corso - Territorial Aggression, and Aggression with 7-12 month old

Sorry for my delay Hector. What I was wanting to know is what would you call brewzer behavior?

 

[Brewzer]

Re: 1 yr old Cane Corso - Territorial Aggression, and Aggression with 7-12 month old

You say you're "strict" with him....I'm $#@!uming that's in the house. You also need to hold him accountable outside. Pay attention to triggers. Go for the fuse before waiting for the bomb to go off. By that time you've lost your opportunity. There are so many little things that go into leading your dog. Often time we blame "phases" or call it aggression when in all actuality it's not. It's fear and insecurity. Sounds to me like your dog is not feeling safe when outside. It's protecting you because, perhaps, he doesn't feel protected by you. That's when dogs start getting fearful, anxious and aggressive. Take a look at what you aren't giving your dog and it might lead you to what your dog is giving you.

No, not just in the home. Any time he "see's red" and lunges/growls - I lay him down. He is 110+ lbs and knows when mommy is laying him down - he had better stay down. 98% of the time he knows better than to try to get up before I tell him it's okay. He's a great dog - listens well, excellent manners - but his fear causes him to see red and act like a psycho dog. You're definitely correct that it's fear, and he is always trying to protect me. I think it's because I'm nervous around strangers, and he's playing off that. Thanks for the advice!!

 

[Brewzer]

Re: 1 yr old Cane Corso - Territorial Aggression, and Aggression with 7-12 month old

Sombody, anybody please explain to me what the heck is fear aggregation, fear phase fear stage? How can someone identify it from plain fear and plain agregation? How can a dog be both at the same time? Brewzer is just growing up and $#@!erting himself. Remember all of the dogs on this forum were bread to be guardians or hunters. This in turn means the have to take the initiative, they have to attack a stranger and or there prey.

.....

Now tell me is that example a case of fear biting or whatever you want to call it or is it
plain old aggression? If you say fear stage, fear aggression how did you make that determination?

Inquiring minds want to know.

Well, I refer to Brewzer as having "Fear aggression" and going through "Fear stages" for two reasons. Largely because when he tried to go for the digits, as you might say, he was trembling and trying very hard to curl up in a ball and withdraw. For him, he tried to flee before fight, but the people in question continued to go for the head pet despite warning just as in your TM case. Secondly, our trainer as well as the mastiff rescue out here suggest that this breed of dog goes through "Fear Stages" where they are more timid, less trusting, etc. and basically test you to see if you'll protect them/or if they have to fight back. Dogs are fight or flight all the way in confrontational scenarios. If they can't flee they'll fight, so maybe the dog felt trapped at the airport after being boarded and being held in a lap? Of course you had to hold him, but he may have been scared because of the flight and all the random handlers to get him from/to you. These breeds should not be approached by people, they should be able to approach the people - then they're usually fine and comfortable because they know they have a choice to come and go from the person rather than feel trapped.

 

[Brewzer]

Re: 1 yr old Cane Corso - Territorial Aggression, and Aggression with 7-12 month old

A lot of times ppl mistake "aggression" for fear and nervousness. It sounds like your dog doesn't feel safe with you and your husband as owners/leaders. When I see people say they are "strict" and we are "alpha" have tried to convince themselves that they are when all reality they aren't. When you have authority over your dog it won't act like that. You can take your dog to a "trainer" all you want, but the real work is done at home...it does no good if your dog feels it needs to protect you....it's not the job of the dog to protect you...it's your job to protect your dog.

I'm not confident you'd say the same thing if you saw the interactions that take place between all of us. I know that I accidentally reinforced bad behavior in him as a puppy. What is confusing about these notions is that he tries to hide behind us when he's scared. If he didn't feel like we keep him safe, wouldn't he try to hide behind....something that isn't us? He will tremble, and lean on us with what feel close to his full body weight, and lunge/growl, then return to his hiding/leaning state. Not at the dog park, though, when he's off leash he's in the pack - and has done so well until the last few weeks! Over the past few weeks, he has transitioned from disliking people to disliking dogs. It seems very strange to me, but I'm sure it's not the first time! He's now good for people - for the most part - but doesn't like dogs. Do you have any idea what dog psychology this might be?? Unless he's just figured out we dislike his dislike for humans and transitioned the anger to dogs(which I doubt), I'm at a loss.

 

[karennj]

Re: 1 yr old Cane Corso - Territorial Aggression, and Aggression with 7-12 month old

Is he fixed?

 

[Hector]

Re: 1 yr old Cane Corso - Territorial Aggression, and Aggression with 7-12 month old

Sorry for my delay Hector. What I was wanting to know is what would you call brewzer behavior?

I agree with what blackshadow has said.

You have a nervous dog. The dog has learned that his behavior/reaction is acceptable in those situations when you two are handling him. I would speak with trainer for suggestions since you mentioned he doesn't do that with the trainer. Nervous dogs do well with direction.

Instead of correcting the dog after he has reacted, I suggest working on some engagement exercises that will increase his focus/attention on you instead of worrying about the people around him. If the dog is paying attention to you/commands, he will be less likely to be reactive to things he shouldn't be. I would start with leash pressure exercises - turns, change of pace, heel, etc. Get that down and apply it in the real world. Since he is reactive to people, use space to keep his stress levels low and his chances of reacting low. It takes practice, patience, and timing to make it all work. Good luck.

[video=youtube;SCnHoqiNAY0]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SCnHoqiNAY0[/video]

[video=youtube;adFDs9SAV-o]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=adFDs9SAV-o[/video]

[video=youtube;eB8dhKNichw]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eB8dhKNichw[/video]

 

[Hector]

Re: 1 yr old Cane Corso - Territorial Aggression, and Aggression with 7-12 month old

As for the dog park, he's being a bully. I would stop taking him there. Find some dogs he gets along with if you want to have play groups. I think he is redirecting from people to dogs is because he is free to make his own choices. Have rules and enforce them.

 

[Brewzer]

Re: 1 yr old Cane Corso - Territorial Aggression, and Aggression with 7-12 month old

Is he fixed?

Yes, we got him fixed at 8 months