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CAFIB.......The Hard Fall DOWN

aceoutdoor

Well-Known Member
Right. Grab a tall red bull and wake yourself up there tough guy. Maybe you can help locate the "documents, possessions, belongings, collections, copies of the journal O FILA and assets of CAFIB, in addition to the genealogical registers, originals and copies of Analysis of Phenotype and Temperament records, causing serious damage to CAFIB" that were "not returned".
 

zebraworks

Well-Known Member
how does former officers not giving back documents become the downfall of the club? it is absurd and I doubt you know half of what is really going on (especially if you don't read portuguese)... it will be interesting to see whether the defectors new club will grow large or if CAFIB will decline in membership...I gather that CAFIB is not too accepting if members join the other club too... be interesting to know what the "rest of the story" is as Paul Harvey used to say
 

aceoutdoor

Well-Known Member
it is absurd and I doubt you know half of what is really going on (especially if you don't read portuguese)...

Zebra I am well informed and aware of what is going on recently and what has been for years. But since you are a cafibber, in the spirit of transparency share with us everything you know about the situation. Enlighten us, and I will be happy to fill in the gaps when your done. Knock yourself out, you got the floor.
 

zebraworks

Well-Known Member
I support CAFIB in their work to preserve the Fila but am not a dues paying member. Using their standard and admiring their accomplishments doesn't require membership. I only read the official announcement from current CAFIB representatives but I know there is another side to the story (as always) which I have not heard yet and language is a big barrier in comprehending the details that individuals are sharing (internet translators IMHO don't convey accurate details in translation...a person who is fluent in the language would be helpful to try to figure out what is really going on with the new club and conflicts amongst former club members and officers.
 

chuckorlando

Well-Known Member
There has to be alot more to the story. Thats what I want to hear.

I would think that if anything is missing that validates any animal or lines, you have to wonder why it is missing, what it's being used for, and if it will be returned un touched and complete. I'm not sure how they do their thing so it might not matter, I dont know.

But if in fact someone was cheating, and doing so on the level ace is talking about, that leaves alot of room for suspicion across the whole club does it not?

Is cafib the "good guys" here or are the new guys?
 

zebraworks

Well-Known Member
I have no idea who the "good guys" and "bad guys" are. it was BS for the departing club officers to not return the items when asked (unless that too has another side to the story). I believe there were accusations made on a particular judges evaluation (not something claimed universally to all CAFIB judges and evaluations)...so I can imagine that is not exactly uncommon to ANY dog association/club/group but the "norm"
 
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mountainfila

Well-Known Member
DId anyone read the link ace posted???? Its all there in black and white, its not about a downfall of the club but some shady dealings within the club.Sounds like a kennel that wins all the time didn't win and was upset with the judge, so in turn took it upon themselves to get rid of the judge. I would like to see a picture of the dog in question, seeing it was awarded best of the best over Zenon do intanduh and then down the road was DQ for being mix bred all by the same judge. And who is this Domingo Lopez lol, as it turns out the said dog is owned by a board member lol this Lopez person didn't even own the dog.
 

tojvan

Well-Known Member
DId anyone read the link ace posted???? Its all there in black and white, its not about a downfall of the club but some shady dealings within the club.Sounds like a kennel that wins all the time didn't win and was upset with the judge, so in turn took it upon themselves to get rid of the judge. I would like to see a picture of the dog in question, seeing it was awarded best of the best over Zenon do intanduh and then down the road was DQ for being mix bred all by the same judge. And who is this Domingo Lopez lol, as it turns out the said dog is owned by a board member lol this Lopez person didn't even own the dog.
I believe Domingo Lopez is the internet "username" that someone used. The picture was sent to zanetti to evaluate the dog. Cafib forbids any kind of picture evals but Zanetti did it anyway. He DQ'd the dog saying its a mastiff/neo mastiff mix. Later it turned out this was the exact same dog that zanetti awarded a ribbon to a little while back. Zanetti lashed out saying itanhandu purposely set him up and wants to sue them over this. Cafib as an organization was appalled by this and forced his resignation as the president. He became bitter and took most of the stuff with him as well as a few of his close friends and now they are starting a new club.
 

aceoutdoor

Well-Known Member
its not about a downfall of the club but some shady dealings within the club.Sounds like a kennel that wins all the time didn't win and was upset with the judge, so in turn took it upon themselves to get rid of the judge.



Actually it is about the down fall of that club. THAT KENNEL, as well as uncle Chico now run whats left of cafib. Nearly everyone else left and took all the goods with them. Even some overseas clubs broke ties with them. There is alot of money to be made so of coarse a few will try to keep it afloat, but people are fed up and left the party. For all real purposes its over.
 

tojvan

Well-Known Member
Actually it is about the down fall of that club. THAT KENNEL, as well as uncle Chico now run whats left of cafib. Nearly everyone else left and took all the goods with them. Even some overseas clubs broke ties with them. There is alot of money to be made so of coarse a few will try to keep it afloat, but people are fed up and left the party. For all real purposes its over.
If everyone left how come there are so many dogs in the live videos of shows that zebraworks posts links to in his threads.
 

mountainfila

Well-Known Member
I see Jan kubesa defected also, isn't he the coveted fila judge that the usa uses in their shows?
And what membership fees are they talking about, what does being a paying "elite" cafib member mean anyway lol and what does it cost to be in the "clique"?
 

zebraworks

Well-Known Member
if evaluation of a photo is a real reason (not sure) it only reinforces the fact that pictures can be deceiving and hard to make judgements from them so better to never do it.
 

tojvan

Well-Known Member
Nobody really knows what happened except for the people involved itanhandu is very sketchy and are fully capable of pulling this stunt. Its nearly impossible to tell who is at fault. I hope that the fila doesn't take a hit from this
 

chuckorlando

Well-Known Member
Of coarse I read it. But all it does is leave more questions. And thats also one side and I believe in the 3 sided rule. It just seems we cant get that. I can say I have watched cafib's fight over what size fly will land on a mongrels ass, so Dogmans weak ass response dont make it seem all peachy.
 

zebraworks

Well-Known Member
And what membership fees are they talking about, what does being a paying "elite" cafib member mean anyway

That is a good question since CAFIB is a "club"...I don't know what it costs or even "how" to join as a individual or kennel? (if anything at all). Their standard and their historical champions stand for themselves over the years. I do think there have been people that have shown filas even in Brazil at other clubs or organization events while also having their dog evaluated by CAFIB and shown at club expositions. I do not recall hearing that CAFIB officially condemned people from doing that before. With any club it does take some organization and some revenue to operate which involves politics or elections and appointments so I can imagine that any kind of club can change over time due to the members and who the "officials" are from time to time.
 
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tojvan

Well-Known Member
That is a good question since CAFIB is a "club"...I don't know what it costs or even "how" to join as a individual or kennel? (if anything at all). Their standard and their historical champions stand for themselves over the years. I do think there have been people that have shown filas even in Brazil at other clubs or organization events while also having their dog evaluated by CAFIB and shown at club expositions. I do not recall hearing that CAFIB officially condemned people from doing that before. With any club it does take some organization and some revenue to operate which involves politics or elections and appointments so I can imagine that any kind of club can change over time due to the members and who the "officials" are from time to time.
Lol they don't they just have a problem with people having ties with zanetti since he f*cked them so hard.
 

aceoutdoor

Well-Known Member
RESPONSE OF FERNANDO ZANETTI

Initially did not intend to respond to the attack made by the "Board", but I feel compelled in the face of false allegations. A club or a company worth its salt has a representative, a president, but as who lack the truth, does not dare show his face hid behind the word "Board". Controversial attitude compared to the race that claim to defend, since it has as main quality the courage, or will not adapt to the training and support comes as see when cornered start attacking with untruths. This is what we find in the texts published by the "Board". We begin by first evaluating the disclosure made days before this same address, with the composition of the board, where we found Mrs.. Sabine S.Callas, appointed as Director Pedigree, incredible as this lady in the email dated June 09 had asked their termination of this club, and the most amazing this same Board insists that it is positioned on his desire to remain at the club, threatening to be expelled for being part of a newly created club in date of 06/07/2014, the AMFIBRA, of which she is founder and director family. Total lack of information or evil intent in wanting to bring discredit this person? I get the last. I chose the latter alternative, because in this same document also try to tarnish the image of two others besides mine, the first of which Dr. Tenissom Cavalcante, until then general secretary of the club, who resigned his post after 10 years of effective work and unique, including widely praised by Mr. Airtom Campbell, who went on to attack him with harsh words when contradicted by its disclosure, which extolled the exhibition held in the city of Itanhandu as the largest held to date that year. Given the precipitous disclosure without caution and mostly not fit him any publicity and not be aware of the criteria adopted, was contested and denied by the then secretary general. Given this fact became Mr. Airton weaving inappropriate comments about Dr. Tenissom, culminating in a board meeting, where Mr. Tenissom participated by video conference, and when irregularities pointed by Judge Jonas to analyze twelve (12) female squad kennel Itanhandu approving for animal breeding low quality, including one known to "clear apathy" (disqualifying foul), leading again Mr. Airton hysterical uncontrollably attacking the moral integrity of Mr. Tenisson, leaving the terrified present. We should clarify that it was decided at the board meeting that any analysis should be accompanied by another judge when these exposures were carried out. Before this resolution was good enough to nullify all analyzes, a fact which led to the discontent of the then secretary of the meeting, Mariana Campbell, who arbitrarily sought to enforce his will by changing the decision in the minutes of the meeting to approve the analyzes. After much discussion, finally became worth the result did not recognize the analyzes performed by Mr. Jonas, as emails below. Amazingly, with my shutdown, Mr. Carlos Cintra and Dr. Tenisson, these same analyzes were restated tampered with but keeping the same numbering with dates that were previously presented. Is for this reason why in desperation seizing the Registry Books Club? . It is worth commenting on the submission of Mr. Giovanni Goiânia with the task, according to the 'Board' to remove the documentation that the club was in the possession of Mr. Tenissom logically a failed attempt, since this gentleman did not even was associated, it did not have any attorney in writing this' Board "for this purpose. Imagine if Mr Tenisson had delivered all the documents in the hands of this gentleman, without at least make use of a protocol! Logically such facts are explained and clarified by Mr. Tenissom in his response to "Board". As for Mr. Carlos Cintra, he will surely show, the deposits made to the account of Sr.Airtom when his departure from the chief financial officer of the club, a position he held for about six months. Does Mr. Airtom reported possession of this money? Because the club does not have its own? As for the site, never belonged to Cafib, widely known by the board of directors, so that is not proven ownership of the documentary field that both claim to be his property, maybe they forgot defamatory urge them to certifying If records of who is the owner and this is also true to the fields of electronic addresses, can even specify the field CAFIB.COM that is for sale on the site BUYDOMINS.COM, this is perhaps the most suitable domain to Club Cafib for in its charter it is simply Cafib without the complement Brazil. Who think fool? Any lay person has this knowledge. As the owner of the domain Mr. Carlos Cintra withdrew the "air" the same content without any explanation which certainly would not have to give at some point. As for genealogical management program that are used as a backdrop for the inconsistent claim that his lack is the reason for delays in the delivery of CAs and ROs, as we know there is more than three months, it never belonged to Cafib or any one of the creators, and its only property belonging to Mr. Francis Fornel, the result of a research project, which began with the sole purpose of assembling, Genealogy Kennel Amparo, incidentally the only former creator of this club to record all their matings in the last 36 (thirty six) years Mr. enthusiastic about the work done for the Kennel Amparo, Fornel extended it to all bloodlines recorded in Cafib, noting that the work was done on their own initiative, fully funded by him, and shall intellectual property, since at any time sold, assigned, donated to whoever copyright by direct labor. As is generally known Mr. Fornel not own or create the Fila Brasileiro. Given the excellent work and following the request of his friend Caicos, allowed the use of their work, keeping for itself the domain being its unique controller and manager, a fact that led Mr. Airton to invite him to assume the position of director computer, with the intention of keeping it close to the club. So the claims about the ownership of this program is merely an immoral attempt to embezzlement totaling defy intellectual property. A shame. Intriguing is the attitude of one of the founders of the club, hitting the chest for his integrity, and knowing these facts support the claims of the board to which it belongs, or will their moral values ​​have changed? itself does not constitute or sale or transfer of property which should be done by itself formality for this purpose. Still on the theme site, it is pointed out here belie the 'board version "as my insurgency against the making of the Kennel Itanhadu this site or its content. My posture, representing myself and other directors Cafib gave up because the statement contained in that work he had done with the help of ALL judges Cafib, indeed evidently liar, that would certainly be being used for the purpose of giving greater credibility and exposed to indirectly recognize the quality of that kennel, since this was using a dog of your property giving the connotation of being the morphology Standard Breed Fila Brasileiro. Took the matter to the board and CAFIB REQUIRED that were changed that statement, since for ETHICS allow not see my name attached to any kennel or breeder, especially one known for strong business and no ideological connotation. Fact that is not shared by the founder of Cafib Mr. Francis Peltier, who maintain on the homepage of their website advertising this kennel. From this date to accuse myself of persecution Itanhandu the kennel, as if he had any interest beyond the Fila Brasileiro. However I plead guilty because maintaining posture and require compliance with rules and applying the rules of the club, which of course hurt the interests of that kennel, so I declare myself guilty of: 1 Require registration of all dogs belonging to the kennel that said creators and followers Cafib. 2 Require registration of all puppies in a litter and not part of them. 3 Require all kennels and breeders to commercialize Cafib seal pups under the full form follow the rules of the club. 4 Countering the use of training geared to the temperament, as a means to make up the true temperament of the animal, according to rules adopted by the creation Cafib 5- Alert the board CAFIB that videos posted on You Tube by kennel Itanhadu demonstrate the practice of training , noting that the same officials who treat or expose dogs are those who perform as guinea pigs in the "proof" temperament. (Copied videos) 6 In Cafib warn the board that there are dogs with kennel Itanhadu clinical deviations, as can be seen in the enormous size of the scrotum dog Volcano Itanhandu, BEST OF BREED at the exhibition Itanhandu, which in my opinion is If a genetic drift, since the defect manifested in dog Zeus Itanhandu exhibited at Expo Brasilia by Mr. Giovanni, and another lying in Rio Grande do Sul. 7 Bring to the attention of the board, advantages obtained by Itanhadu kennel of dogs with the approval of questionable quality, and objectionable by the rules of this club, approved by Judge Jonas. Fact of approval of twelve females indicated above. 8- be against the act of the President in approving a female Luciano erratically in an attempt to hide previous error, after all a mistake does not justify another. 9-To submit to the board the fact that this kennel use is dubious practices with the sole purpose of exporting puppies its inception and others. Added to the above, numerous emails from breeders who have purchased dogs from this "reputable" kennel, and received animals with dysplasia without registration issued by Cafib of puppies, and even without any record, which exhausted all attempts to see your money refunded or exchanged your puppy went to the club to complain. Thus we can say that the board was aware of the mismanagement of this kennel. As regards exposure, perhaps this "BOARD" can enlighten us as a kennel with about 60 animals, may be nominated as the successful creation, since their success has always been based on only one or two dogs, I believe this to be ' board "making a huge mess because quantity is not synonymous with quality. Indeed, the best pickers find those breeders who keep small squad, based solely on animals of very good quality and not approved in females in the dead of night, with regular quality and even with apparent apathy? Do not come to me talking about "Tapetão", let's talk about criteria, concepts that are locked by this "board." Many irregularities were pointed out to the board and not really documented at the request of Mr. Campbell Airtom, which he claimed should WASHING OUR LAUNDRY AT HOME, but now I think I am missing soap, so nothing better than this wash clothes in PUBLIC, so that everyone may take note of the color of the water that comes out of this cleaning. It is certain that all those who refused to participate in this walk in honor of the kennel Itanhandu, have been harassed, as in the case of the creator and president of the Club Onceiro the Czech Republic, who refused to campaign in favor of female Fairy Itanhandu, approved on a female phenotype and temperament analysis by that club, just with good temperament with clear training for this purpose, as admitted even his owner, who refused to participate in the exhibition by recognizing that his female had a temper too below the dogs that were presented there and later received a certificate from one of the many clubs in Europe existing training without any link with the CAFIB. Amazingly, the titled Father Cafib, Mr. Peltier had displante Francisco to demand that Mr. Jan Kubesa do the propaganda of this award. Faced with the refusal to make it passed Mr. Jan Kubesa being harassed by the founder Mr. Peltier, without the "BOARD" virtuous and impartial take any initiative to position itself in favor of Mr. Kubesa, an odd popularizer Cafib , the abiding unique touted by the club, in fact the only representative of this club or former representative abroad to have 100% of litters of his associates recorded in Cafib, a person of odd character. Was insulted and discredited by the board Cafib, and even with my request against President Luciano for a ruling regarding sending to Mr. Kubesa a formal apology on behalf of the club, it did not. As a result they decided to suspend the membership of Onceiro logical that this would have the attitude Onceiro refuses to benefit this or that creator, just like keeping their principles, only aiming at the Fila Brasileiro. Cafib really never had a chief, always the decisions were taken by vote of the board, and the members of the current "board" since unaware fact, I believe that is due to refrain from answering the call of the meeting, given that the Most were-away "for personal reasons" as claimed, the exception of Mr. Americo. Thus the present and voted and decided none of the secretaries of these meetings tried to tamper with the minutes with the decisions taken by the board as did Marian Campbell, to try rather, the "Tapetão" enforce the will of the kennel Itanhandu and disrespect for rules Judge Jonas with the approval of 12 females of dubious quality kennel belonging to that which is "consultant", a clear conflict of interest between the rules of the club and the kennel. After our exit this conflict ceased to exist since the approval was accepted. How can the founder and creator of Cafib not, Mr. Peltier allow this to happen because the accuser is a staunch creators attached to BKC by naming them mixers, to create queues aberration, etc offending parents, and posting criticize photos atypical dogs, while admitting that dogs of dubious quality receive the club he claims to be such registration! The acts of this "board" demonstrate it rather be surrounded by caciques, who act arbitrarily and contrary to the statutes partners but let's see: The call and the election of Mr. Luciano Hawk, gave up letting you meet the statutory requirements, since at no time was the call for this purpose of the club members, then President Airtom meeting in Campbell resigned from his post at the same time appointed his successor. The Board noted the actions taken by Mr. Jonas along with the kennel Itanhandu and failed to fulfill the precepts of their statutes. The board learned that a judge representing the club acted improperly, at least three times, completely drunk. The board fails to recognize the sovereignty of the general assembly to convene leaving it as the statute prescribes. How can this "BOARD" states exempted without addictions and self proclaim themselves masters of integrity or state that remain true to his principles? For those unaware of the history of Cafib, is history is of paramount importance as stated by Mr. Peltier, approximately two decades ago I was approached by Mr. Campbell Airtom, to assume the presidency of the club Cafib, and that would be afastar- the club's activities for particular problems. So, without convening the General Assembly was inaugurated President, thereafter I learned of total abandonment which had become the club literally bankrupt, with very few discouraged and associated finally total chaos. Before this I invited Mr. Caicos Cintra to help me exposing him the difficulties We thus working; first to restructure the club and concomitantly motivate associates to return the club's activities. Enlisting the help of friends, among them Mr. Francisco Fornel able catch up on all documentation, records and perform increasingly exhibitions. As you well know not create commercially, my litters are sporadic, not present in dogs exhibitions, a practice adopted by becoming Judge of this club. I joined this club in its first year of existence, and I did it via conviction as the practice of increasingly pronounced mixing between the creators of the then CBKC, which did not agree, and the Cafib came against my ideology. I do not have the vanity of awards, but in owning a worthy representative specimen of the breed. I like north to breed Fila Brasileiro, not dodging friendships or interference by the club, not denying me transfer knowledge or to guide creators, I am known for not having "popes" in the language and not swipe me in responding to unfair attacks.Maintain friendships with breeders who follow the guidance CBKC Cafib, Unifila, always respecting their views in relation to Brazilian Fila, respect them to be respected, and most unusual that perhaps can present their dogs up, not accuse their owners mixers for not witness such practices. I believe that on these facts, and have the "BOARD" Cafib aware of this, and knowing that I, along with Mr. Caicos Cintra belonging to traditional family of dog breeders Breed Fila Brasileiro, taking the dogs of its creation been used as a basis for the creation of the main creators of Brazil and abroad, Dr. Tenissom Cavalcante, possessor of Dogs worthy representatives of the breed in the city of Goiania, GO, Adriano M. Pacheco great creator in the city of Belo Horizonte and many other traditional breeders , unhappy with the new direction of the club they belonged, we formalized the creation of an NGO, the AMFIBRA, with the ultimate goal, the defense of the Fila Brasileiro breed as we know, was this "board" innominate, in an act of utter desperation attacking and attempting to denigrate towards the company's founders AMFIBRA. Personally thank this attack, since it allowed me to expose facts until then lock and key. How can we believe in a "board" that hides even of its members, information and invitations in favor of the interests of others? Indeed, a few months ago, the creator Linda Maggio resident in the United States informed the Cafib its intention to hold an exhibition of the club Cafib that country, as it had done at other times, at first indicated to me to judge, communicated my shutdown club, asked me to help in the choice of a judge immediately stated Mr. Peter Borotti, and so she requested to judge, and got an answer from Mr. Luciano to convey the invitation that judge. Days later was communicated by Mr. Peltier, it will be a chief, he who would judge Mr. Jonas would be in the company of Mrs.. Cintia and also judge a week before another exhibition, organized by Mr. Juan, a fact which displeased that creative who insisted again in the person of Mr. Peter, and again was denied. Given this fact and tried myself advised that the call was made directly to Peter, and he did so, which was immediately accepted by Mr. Borotti. Strange transparency of this club, it says free, attacking former members and hides invitation to the justices, or will the vested interests dominated and led to betray directors directors? How can we believe in a club, which for decades attacked CBKC, exploiting the fact of it have proceeded from arbitrary form with the expulsion of its creators frames adherents Cafib, and now proceed similarly threatening persecution or expulsion of creators by ventura supported the AMFIBRA will be two weights and two measures? Attacking the founders of AMFIBRA takes me back to the past, and maybe they can re-read a letter published by the creative Pentagna Marilia (The Journal FILA - 36 -pg 6/7) with the title "PRESSURES" hehehe nothing more appropriate, that surely the Messrs directors forgotten, or will become branch decided that they both attacked, perhaps psychology explain. Since the newspaper quoted the FILA fit here deny ownership of it, he does not belong to Cafib since it was sold without any clause, thus, its use, since it recognized the authorship of the articles and their origin is not subject to any restriction. When talking about property, the use of Racial Pattern written by Dr. Paul S. Cruz, is false to claim that their use is restricted or is owned by the club Cafib the Racial Standard referred to is in the public domain, since it is based on the description of an animal breed, recognized internationally, who intend to deceive? Still on the theme deceives, or property, not to speak of partial use of a logo, the design is referred to the outline of a dog of breed Brazilian Fila and this is not the object of intellectual property, in fact not even Cafib logo has reservation, since unknown whether any reservation ensured by its record on trademarks and patents, once again I ask who intend to deceive? Do not judge others by their incompetence. Again under the theme of intellectual property, this time Visual Standard prepared by the artist Marilda Malet, referred to, I invite you to read carefully to whom it belongs and to which title has been prepared, printed and distributed by PURINA, Really are lost, attacking with lies and distorting facts. What a shame to have to write research evidence in surround ourselves lest we be labeled as frivolous. Frivolous and defamatory statements innominate this "board" regarding dog Tigre de Santa Luzia, and the charges made by a FAKE, that even as give credit to someone who does not exist, or rather a coward who hides behind a name . Why not earn credit leave a comment on it, however attached the comment of Mr. Peltier Francisco. For those that perhaps have further questions, the dog Tigre de Santa Luzia is still alive just to see it in person and compare it to Zenom Itanhandu to seeing which one best represents the Fila Brasileiro.

FERNANDO ZANETTI
 

aceoutdoor

Well-Known Member
  • Reiterates that as of Aug, 10th/14, due only the unacceptable misappropriation described above, CAFIB will proceed with the end of all of its members who are already active or will join the board of this new club, whose founders misappropriated CAFIB goods, as will end its relationship with Onceiro Club;
  • And thus CAFIB close this thread because it believes that the position taken and released by CAFIB was very well proven, as members requested, and thus ratifies its position and opinion on this matter, enclosing it in this sphere.
Kind regards,
CAFIB - Board
 

tojvan

Well-Known Member
I read the whole thing but it was hard to make sense of the information . what's your take on this Ace?
 

aceoutdoor

Well-Known Member
"After all, they not only act against CAFIB but also against the Fila Brasileiro? Who is actually acting against the Fila Brasileiro? CAFIB or Onceiro Club, Jan Kubesa and former directors of CAFIB that will organize a new club?"