Zignature vs Earthborn

Discussion in 'Health & Nutritional Care' started by neverborn, Jan 25, 2018.

  1. neverborn

    neverborn Member

    Been a long time since I have been here.

    We have a 6 year old English Mastiff. She's had allergy issues since she was probably 2. The second she eats any sort of chicken or wheat her ears puff up like balloons and her faces itches. The doc usually gives her steroids for that. We have tried very hard to avoid giving her anything with grain/poultry.

    The past year though I think it's gotten worse. Her ears don't puff up too often but her face itches so bad she will rub her eyebrow off. If you put your hand on her face she smashes into it and grinds. When she greets me she grinds her head into me and it makes her back leg kick.

    We feed her Earthborn coastal catch. Treats.. usually whatever we find that is grain free/poultry free. We also give her fruit and fresh veggies often. Apples, oranges, green peppers, lettuce, etc. She loves everything. Her grandparents watch her during the day and usually give her peanut butter in the morning, some fruit around lunch and half a banana per day.

    She takes 6 benedryl in the morning and 6 at night. With meals. Per vet orders.

    Her weight is healthy according to the vet at about 140lbs. She basically only goes outside for potty breaks, and walks in good weather.

    I've heard that Zignature is a good food for dogs with allergies, but comparing the ingredients to what we give her now - I'm not sure there is that big of a difference. I'm curious what makes it better, if anything? I'm also open to other suggestions because the vet wants to put her on Apoquel. To me, that seems like a huge expense for something that may do her more harm than good.
  2. Hector

    Hector Well-Known Member

    Stop with the peanut butter!! The sugar feeds and makes allergies worse! I would go with zignature salmon and pea. The more limited the better. Stay away from potatoes also. Get some 1% zymox with hydrocortisone for ears. I would stop treats. You want to put her on a very limited diet to rule out food allergies. Once the dog does well on a food, you can start introducing 1 type of treat. Most important thing with dogs that have allergies is to limit their food intake to only their kibble, no extras. Give it a week and you should see a positive response if the dog is eating something it's not allergic to. I have helped a dog that was nearly bald recover 50+% of her hair in 3 weeks. She was on zignature salmon and pea and low dose of steroids.
  3. Hector

    Hector Well-Known Member

    Oh and a note on apoquel. The bald foster dog was on apoquel since aug and she came to my house in nov and her skin was greasy and covered in lesion s. She literally smelled like wet skunk spray. I couldnt have her in the same room. At my house, she ate nothing but her dog food and that's it. Saw a huge difference in 1 week. And I'm not saying that zignature is going to work for you dog, but am saying that restricted food intake is a life changer.
  4. Boxergirl

    Boxergirl Well-Known Member

    I agree with cutting out the peanut butter. It's surprising how many dogs really don't tolerate it well. I also agree with kibble only for several weeks and then adding in one thing at a time to see what effect it has. As for the Apoquel, most of the people that I know that have tried it are extremely pleased and feel that it's worth the cost for them. I have no personal experience with it. I would limit food first and see what happens.

    Really sorry your girl is so miserable. I hope you find some relief for her.
  5. Jakesmum

    Jakesmum Well-Known Member

    I have Jake on Zignature Kangaroo and he seems to do very well on it. He has a lot of allergy issues and is on Atopica and Ketoconozole for these issues as well as a daily low dose antibiotic as he has a lot of bacteria issues (we have his bloodwork done on a regular basis to make sure that the medications are not affecting his liver and kidney and so far he's still very healthy). I've heard that Apoquel works really well too as suggested above. As for treats I was giving him some fairly pricy vegan dog cookies that are limited ingredient, but recently I've started making his dog cookies from oatmeal, pumpkin or squash, either applesauce or grated carrot and a couple of eggs (I found the recipe online and cut out the salt that he put in it) and he loves them! Much cheaper and I know what ingredients are in it.
  6. Nik

    Nik Well-Known Member

    Oh can you share your dog treat recipe? That sounds great. :)
  7. neverborn

    neverborn Member

    We did cut peanut butter from her for several weeks at once point, but noticed no difference so we went back. I think we may try as suggested, I'll pick up a bag of the zignature and we'll eliminate all other stuff.

    Also, yesterday our Mastiff count doubled. Picked up a brindle 8 month old. She's pretty traumatized by her second change of home in her short life. Also a high mistrust of men. She's side eyeing me a lot. Going to be a process getting her comfortable with me.

    Thank you for the feedback on her diet. I appreciate it.
  8. Hector

    Hector Well-Known Member

    I would still stop with the peanut butter. All that sugar isn't good and doesnt help with inflammation or allergies.
  9. Hector

    Hector Well-Known Member

    With allergies, you won't want to resume feeding 1 thing just because there isn't a change. It could be affected by a combination of foods and not just the peanut butter alone. If the dog's allergies are very severe, I suggest a full thyroid panel and food allergen test done if you are not able to control her symptoms with a strict diet. Strict means absolutely not even 1 morsel of non-kibble (yes I was that strict, same with my lil dog). This is the only way to do narrow down on triggers otherwise you're fighting a losing battle.
    neverborn likes this.
  10. DennasMom

    DennasMom Well-Known Member

    From a human experience... allergies are weird, and as Hector mentioned, can be a build up of lots of little sensitivities.

    My mom broke out in hives - and she couldn't pinpoint any one thing that was different in her life. After lots of testing, we decided it was due to her eating a wide variety of foods each of which she had low-grade sensitivities to. She cut out ALL suspect foods for over 6 months, and finally got her system "clean"... now she can have limited amounts of almost all the things that she tested as allergic to, and does fine, she just can't "load up" on any one or any mix of her trigger foods at one time. She's still VERY careful, and now has to carry an epi-pen, since things out of the blue will hit her wrong (like tree pollens).

    So.... definitely go "cold turkey" with a strict "just kibble" diet for a long time, then slowly test adding one new ingredient at a time, with at least a 2-week interval to test for reactions.

    And, if you can, you might consider a home-prepared diet (either raw or cooked), which would give you 100% control over what's going in the foods - just in case it's one of the common preservatives in kibble that's causing the underlying problem.
  11. Hector

    Hector Well-Known Member

    Oh I want to add my personal experience with an allergic reaction to benadryl. One once in awhile has been fine, sometimes I take two when things get bad. One time I started taking 1 (2? can't remember what I was taking) a night before I went to bed. I think after the 4th day, my hands started breaking out in little spots around the finger joints and wrist. It was so itchy. In fact it felt like pesky gnat bites. I was itching for days, but was confused why it was happening as I didn't eat anything out of the ordinary then I realized omg maybe it's the benadryl. I stopped that immediately and the itchies went away.
  12. Hector

    Hector Well-Known Member

    I also cannot eat beef , not hamburger beef, but like beef roast raw packaged stuff for consecutive days at a time. Eventually I will break out in heat rashes on my armpits and chest. It's the strangest thing haha. I have to take breaks in between beef consumption. I've tested this over and over again lol.
  13. Jakesmum

    Jakesmum Well-Known Member

    Hi Nik, the recipe is from brucebradley.com:
    5 cups rolled oats (regular or quick)
    1 cup canned pumpkin puree (I've used cooked butternut squash too)
    2 large eggs
    1/2 cup applesauce (I grated a carrot the last time as I had no applesauce)
    1/2 cup whole wheat flour or oat flour (I use oat bran for this)
    Preheat oven to 300 degrees F. Line baking sheets with parchment.
    Mix the oats, pumpkin, eggs and applesauce until it resembles a thick coarse cookie dough.
    Put the oat flour in a separate bowl. Roll tablespoon sized scoops of dough in your hands and then coat with the oat flour. Place on cookie sheet and flatten in with the bottom of a glass, they don't spread out so you can put them close together.
    Bake for 50-60 minutes. The treats are finished when lightly brown.
    Nik likes this.

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