19 Week Old EM Biting

[shawn.bowie.80]

I have a 19 week old English Mastiff that is biting on the arms of me the wife and kids. It's not a hard bite just some sometimes the kids cry when he does. Has anybody had any problems with this thanks.

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[gilles]

hello thats the same message i sent to sir james responding to a similar post..., your puppy is just normal, i had few like this and now they are angels, but you need patience...there are many methods for correction, like directing him away to bite a toy or something, i used this method and worked very well with one of the most strong headed CAO i had, but do not expect a day or two for correction, ..give it a week or so but be consistent: get a choke chain and tuck it in your hand, as he tries to bite you say NO and throw the chain on him , the metallic sound will stop him. do it every time he tries to bite and if he stops biting reward him immediately...after few times all you need is just to shake the chain that is tucked in your hand let it make sound and just by the sound of it he should not bite, if it works then immediately reward. reward every time he listens to you and stops biting. it takes few days and he will stop. also as you go in the room its not allowed that he jumps on you,use the chain and the same principle as above... then order him to sit , if he does.... reward. jumping on you as you come in is not allowed ...he should sit when you come in...same as you take him out, open the door and order him to sit (keep a chain with you in case he does not listen and shake it ,,,) after he sits you go out the door first and you call him to come. these are essential to establish your leadership which will help him obey you in the biting matter... the only problem is that your wife must also establish her leadership and practice the same method. and dont forget reward reward reward every time he listens to you and the reward must be a treat that he really likes and lots of hugs and love. its the worst age so be patientRead more: Mastiff Forum

 

[gilles]

i am not sure where the last two words" read more" came from. anyway you have to also start obedience training extensively it will help in overall behavior....

 

[shawn.bowie.80]

hello thats the same message i sent to sir james responding to a similar post..., your puppy is just normal, i had few like this and now they are angels, but you need patience...there are many methods for correction, like directing him away to bite a toy or something, i used this method and worked very well with one of the most strong headed CAO i had, but do not expect a day or two for correction, ..give it a week or so but be consistent: get a choke chain and tuck it in your hand, as he tries to bite you say NO and throw the chain on him , the metallic sound will stop him. do it every time he tries to bite and if he stops biting reward him immediately...after few times all you need is just to shake the chain that is tucked in your hand let it make sound and just by the sound of it he should not bite, if it works then immediately reward. reward every time he listens to you and stops biting. it takes few days and he will stop. also as you go in the room its not allowed that he jumps on you,use the chain and the same principle as above... then order him to sit , if he does.... reward. jumping on you as you come in is not allowed ...he should sit when you come in...same as you take him out, open the door and order him to sit (keep a chain with you in case he does not listen and shake it ,,,) after he sits you go out the door first and you call him to come. these are essential to establish your leadership which will help him obey you in the biting matter... the only problem is that your wife must also establish her leadership and practice the same method. and dont forget reward reward reward every time he listens to you and the reward must be a treat that he really likes and lots of hugs and love. its the worst age so be patientRead more: Mastiff Forum

Thanks i will do this.

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[Hiraeth]

get a choke chain and tuck it in your hand, as he tries to bite you say NO and throw the chain on him , the metallic sound will stop him. do it every time he tries to bite and if he stops biting reward him immediately...after few times all you need is just to shake the chain that is tucked in your hand let it make sound and just by the sound of it he should not bite, if it works then immediately reward.]

This is horrible advice. Truly, absolutely horrible advice.

OP, your puppy is trying to interact with you and show you affection. Currently, the only way your puppy knows how to do that is through mouthing you. If you cause him pain every time he tries to interact with you, you're going to damage his relationship with you and greatly negatively influence his desire to interact with you.

Stick with redirecting to a toy when he nips and either leaving the room or stepping over a baby gate to get away from him if he repeatedly targets your skin.

 

[gilles]

This is horrible advice. Truly, absolutely horrible advice. OP, your puppy is trying to interact with you and show you affection. Currently, the only way your puppy knows how to do that is through mouthing you. If you cause him pain every time he tries to interact with you, you're going to damage his relationship with you and greatly negatively influence his desire to interact with you.Stick with redirecting to a toy when he nips and either leaving the room or stepping over a baby gate to get away from him if he repeatedly targets your skin.

i never ever use force or pain with my dogs ...never. you never use force or pain to train a cao its all positive reinforcement. the chain will not hurt or cause any kind of pain it will only startle the dog to remind him like a clicker but it works much much better. this method is used by expert sergei klochko who is a trainer and dog psychologist and behaviorist and judge with a 40 years experience and who happens to be aginst violence in training dogs..he never used a choke chain or prong on my dogs...some dogs are to head strong and redirecting will not work at all...i had many types oif characters and now they are all angels

 

[DennasMom]

Wow... I agree wit Hiraeth. This is a baby dog... at 19 weeks... similar mentally to a human toddler. Physical punishments will do nothing but instill fear and reactivity in a dog that will one day be much, much stronger than you, physically.

1. kids should wear long sleeves and not be on the floor with the puppy if they don't want puppy teeth on their skin.

2. kids should not be running around, screaming or laughing in high pitched voices around the puppy unless they want the puppy to chase them and bite them. (this is normal puppy behavior).

3. if you want a calm puppy, you need calm humans in the room.

4. anytime the puppy's teeth TOUCH human skin, STOP MOVING (movement will excite the puppy more), then "YIPE" like a fellow puppy to alert the puppy that he's done something to hurt the human. As soon as he flinches or backs away, reward with a calm "thank you"... then present an alternative item to chew on - a plush toy, bone or other approved chew toy. I call this "Yipe" and Redirect. Once the puppy bites the toy, make the toy play with him... that is the reward for chewing on the toy and not the human.

5. repeat #4 about 20 times daily for the next 3 months.

6. be patient, calm and generous with your puppy. You will get out what you put in. Put lots of love and good things in!

 

[gilles]

and the method i described works like a charm in extreme cases where everything else fails and still it does not hurt or cause any pain or trauma to the dog... sorry Hiraeth but you misunderstood the method..i am the guy who spent more than one month to train my dog to get in the car without causing him any psychological trauma and i work step by step very slowly for that purpose.

 

[gilles]

Wow... I agree wit Hiraeth. This is a baby dog... at 19 weeks... similar mentally to a human toddler. Physical punishments will do nothing but instill fear and reactivity in a dog that will one day be much, much stronger than you, physically.1. kids should wear long sleeves and not be on the floor with the puppy if they don't want puppy teeth on their skin. 2. kids should not be running around, screaming or laughing in high pitched voices around the puppy unless they want the puppy to chase them and bite them. (this is normal puppy behavior).3. if you want a calm puppy, you need calm humans in the room.4. anytime the puppy's teeth TOUCH human skin, STOP MOVING (movement will excite the puppy more), then "YIPE" like a fellow puppy to alert the puppy that he's done something to hurt the human. As soon as he flinches or backs away, reward with a calm "thank you"... then present an alternative item to chew on - a plush toy, bone or other approved chew toy. I call this "Yipe" and Redirect. Once the puppy bites the toy, make the toy play with him... that is the reward for chewing on the toy and not the human.5. repeat #4 about 20 times daily for the next 3 months.6. be patient, calm and generous with your puppy. You will get out what you put in. Put lots of love and good things in!

i agree with your method if it works then great but some dogs are very active and head strong and this will not work and after few months the dog is already big enough to hurt a kid... anyway you also misunderstood me, what i suggested will in no way hurt the dog or give him any ideas that i am using punishment or force , the chain is like a wake up call and that is how the dog will perceive it... no violence is allowed in training CAO,s and if you come and see my dogs you will understand how much caring and patience was used in training them . Kazimir and Nita are still puppies but big ones and around children they just act so wise and so calm. Kazi was always calm and he did not need any major correction, but nita s nick name was crocodile she had a very strong character and biting was her major hobby ..and biting hard even when playing...at 4 months all kinds of biting stopped and now at 7.5 months she is such a sweet lady especially around kids.

 

[Boxergirl]

i never ever use force or pain with my dogs ...never. you never use force or pain to train a cao its all positive reinforcement. the chain will not hurt or cause any kind of pain it will only startle the dog to remind him like a clicker but it works much much better. this method is used by expert sergei klochko who is a trainer and dog psychologist and behaviorist and judge with a 40 years experience and who happens to be aginst violence in training dogs..he never used a choke chain or prong on my dogs...some dogs are to head strong and redirecting will not work at all...i had many types oif characters and now they are all angels

There's really nothing positive about throw chains. Positive punishment maybe, but the word positive in that context means adding something unpleasant. Back when I had my first dog, shaker cans were a big thing. Same idea as the throw chain. I didn't know better and used one. Unfortunately I had a soft dog and it was - well, it was a very bad choice on my part. I had to work hard to repair some damage caused by that. Using a sound as an interrupter is different than throwing the chain or can AT the dog. I would never do that now, nor would I recommend it to anyone else. There are other ways to deal with a biting puppy.

Throw chains and clickers are completely different. A clicker is not used as an interrupter or to startle the dog. It's used to mark the correct behavior the instant it occurs. It's an extremely effective way to train if done properly. I posted some videos in the training section a while ago from the clicker expo. I think you might find them interesting.

 

[gilles]

Boxer girl you only have to throw the chain once or twice then after that just shaking it is enough.. and only i repeat only used in extreme dogs where nothing else works, and no the chain will not cause any psychological trauma or anything at all for head strong puppies, but it has to be used properly not with violence and with very strong characters: guaranteed by my dog trainer sergei Klochko expert dog behaviorist and psychologist . by the way a clicker is just a waste of money you can do clicks with your mouth ..same thing anyway i dont want to go in a training debate ... and you are right no method should be used without a visit ...you dont train a dog through the internet the dog must be visited by the trainer

 

[gilles]

and a shaker can is not like a chain..a chain barely makes noise, but noise with a frequency that is perceived clearly by the dog without any trauma, while a shaker can is loud and very disturbing.

 

[gilles]

when you throw the chain or shake it the dog will not think badly of you ..the chain is maybe unpleasant not you...you are rewarding right after that so you are good... always reward after

 

[teodora]

The throw chain can end up being plain dangerous. Jack is going nuts at the sound of a chain or any metal (coins in a box for example) - just because. He's never been abused or trained with chains, but he goes in a frenzy mood, dilated eyes, hackles and all - good luck trying to calm him down. I CAN calm him down but I'm the only person who can and only using a calm voice. If I would try to be the brave "alpha" and wind him up more when hes already overexcited it simply wouldn't work.

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[gilles]

teodora each dog has a way and a method better to see the dog first, some dogs go crazy with koud sounds and some dont even care... so better to know the dog first,....

 

[teodora]

Yep, agree. That's what I said it can be dangerous: there are some dogs like Jack who would react in a totally unexpected way to a chain.

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[season]

I use my voice to correct. If so does something I don't want or like I say NO. He stops. IF he does something he's suppose to do he gets praised. Pretty simple. No gimmicks. We are either the best tool for our dogs or the worst.

 

[Hiraeth]

Boxer girl you only have to throw the chain once or twice then after that just shaking it is enough.. and only i repeat only used in extreme dogs where nothing else works, and no the chain will not cause any psychological trauma or anything at all for head strong puppies, but it has to be used properly not with violence and with very strong characters: guaranteed by my dog trainer sergei Klochko expert dog behaviorist and psychologist . by the way a clicker is just a waste of money you can do clicks with your mouth ..same thing anyway i dont want to go in a training debate ... and you are right no method should be used without a visit ...you dont train a dog through the internet the dog must be visited by the trainer

If the method is only to be used in "extreme" dogs who can't be fixed using other methods, why are you suggesting it to a person with a 19 week old puppy?

Also, did you ever even pause to consider that if you teach the puppy that the chain = punishment/discomfort, actually USING a chain collar or prong on the dog will be made extremely difficult because the dog will instantly shy away when you bring it out to put it on?

Honestly. I see a lot of bad and dangerous advice given to people every day. Throwing a chain collar at a puppy's face to punish it for trying to interact with its new humans takes the cake for the last few weeks, it truly does.

 

[gilles]

If the method is only to be used in "extreme" dogs who can't be fixed using other methods, why are you suggesting it to a person with a 19 week old puppy? Also, did you ever even pause to consider that if you teach the puppy that the chain = punishment/discomfort, actually USING a chain collar or prong on the dog will be made extremely difficult because the dog will instantly shy away when you bring it out to put it on? Honestly. I see a lot of bad and dangerous advice given to people every day. Throwing a chain collar at a puppy's face to punish it for trying to interact with its new humans takes the cake for the last few weeks, it truly does.

excuse me but i never give dangerous advice ... i am no irresponsible owner who just happens to talk i deal with probably the most dangerous lets say extreme dogs ....that act like the most loving teddy bears the chain is not a punishment its a confirmation of a NO order, it is not thrown at a puppy s face,,,,,i never use prongs or chain collars when training my dogs, chains and prongs are much more significant than throwing a chain, it is a direct physical contact with your dog and correcting with a prong or a choke chain means you are directly inflicting punishment. so i never use them with my dogs, i used to but sergei taught me why its wrong ...and these are no ordinary dogs . chains and prongs are used in police dog training not for CAO's...anyway i dont like to go into a debate i can get you sergei's website and discuss with him, ..and he is no ordinary trainer trust me he is way beyond what you see on TV shows ... thank you

 

[Hiraeth]

I don't watch TV show trainers. And I'm not really here to get in a p***ing match with you. I've dealt with aggressive dogs. Including one who put a child in the hospital needing reconstructive facial surgery.

You know why that's not the point? That's not what OP is dealing with. OP is dealing with a mouthing puppy. Not a dangerous dog who needs intervention and extreme training methods.

You know what the best way to turn a puppy into an aggressive dog is? To listen to your advice and to deal out physical punishments like throwing a chain at its face in response to regular behaviors.