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How do you handle this?

Rugers-Kris

Well-Known Member
I will openly admit that I haven't looked to deep into the "neuter/don't neuter" argument. Personally, I don't neuter EVER unless there is a medical reason to do so. I don't see the point in neutering a dog unless you aren't responsible enough to be sure that no unwanted litters come from it. I won't take an un-neccessary risk with putting a dog under without a viable cause. Also, I work very hard with my dogs (always have) and I have never had a dog with major behavorial issues and they were never neutered. I agree that you can train manners regardless of whether your dog is intact or not.
 

Iymala

Well-Known Member
When I owed a Great Dane, who was intact, I used to get confronted all the time when I lived in Austin, TX. People there are very dog interested and want to tell you what you should do with your dogs. My Dane was never neutered, never bred, and never had any growth related issues. I did run across the occasional nutso that asked me if they could stud to him, but I explained why he was never going to be bred (Merle, conformation issues). I never had anyone push it to the point of pissing me off. Heree in Mass. everyone seems to mind their own business. My vet did not even ask me if I was planning to neuter or not to and certainly did not push it.

I do agree with Catia on the "general public" issue. I do not believe most dog owners are capable or prepared to handle an intact male or female dog. I strangly have no issue with lying to the public either. The amount of educated and responsible dog owners is a small percentage of the population, but the greater majority are people who either cannot understand scientific research or have no desire to understand it. They want a fast, simple reason that they can embrace and make sense of. The spay and neuter campaigns have provided that. If someone is going to make the choice not to spay or neuter, it should be an educated decision and one they researched well before deciding. If they cannot be bothered to understand why they should not spay or neuter at 6mos, then they probably are not prepared to handle a hormonal dog (at least a large or giant breed).

On the Great Dane forum I am a part of, they(reputable breeders) often recommend spaying/neutering around 8-10mo to avoid the behavioral issues with hormonal maturation. Is that the best thing for growth, certainly not, but will it save some dogs from being rehomed due to undesirable behavior that owners are too lazy or stupid to train out, yes. I can see the good intentions in the Spay/Neuter campaign. Trying to stop accidental or stupidly planned litters, trying to avoid hormone driven behavior in poorly trained dogs that cause them to end up in shelters or rescues, and to increase the chance of positive dog on dog interactions by removing hormones. I see the good there, and for a lot of people it heavily out weighs the bad.

For me? I do not believe in altering my dogs until they are 2-3years old. It is a decision I am prepared and happy to defend, and I have no issue telling someone that we will "agree to disagree".
 

Rugers-Kris

Well-Known Member
A reputable breeder suggesting people neuter or spay that early is one that does not need to be considered "reputable" at all!Tomorrow my Great Dane pup will be home (I AM SO EXCITED!!) and he will not be neutered unless something medical comes up that requires it at some point. I am not very good at trying to explain to someone why Ruger is not neutered. The fact is that I am not good at explaining anything I do to someone else. I suppose it could be helpful for those out there that are open to learning but I don't have the patience or the desire to have people questioning my decisions. I have went as far as explaining that Giant dogs should not be neutered until they are 2 years old and offered a bit of the information. When I get one of "those" people that are just beside themselves that my dog is intact I just tell them that I can see several reasons why I would be all for neuturing/spaying THEM but my dog is good. LOL
 

ruthcatrin

Well-Known Member
On the Great Dane forum I am a part of, they(reputable breeders) often recommend spaying/neutering around 8-10mo to avoid the behavioral issues with hormonal maturation. Is that the best thing for growth, certainly not, but will it save some dogs from being rehomed due to undesirable behavior that owners are too lazy or stupid to train out, yes.

But it DOESN'T. Thats the problem. Or if it does its an extremely small percentage of "some". A huge portion of what makes those behaviors a problem is training and general "doggy behavior" and has very little to do with hormones. Just think of how many new people on here post about how their 10 week old pup is already humping something! If the dog owner isn't prepared to deal with those behaviors regardless then the dog is very likely to do them, and the chances of him being rehomed because of them do not change. If anything the lies about early spay/neuter make it worse because the owner goes into it thinking that they're going to prevent or stop those problems and in a HUGE percentage of the case they aren't!
 

ruthcatrin

Well-Known Member
So I'm gonna add a question here for info's sake. Most of you know Boone has an undescended testicle, which the vet can't find right now. The advice I've received is to get him neutered once he's neuterable age (I'm waiting till he's at least two) but not wait too long after that as he could get testicular cancer. Are you saying that if I don't get him neutered, his chances of some kind of cancer are LOWER than if I do get him snipped?

An undecended testicle changes the odds unfortunetly. The odds of testicular cancer increase by a fairly signifigant amount (that link is one I lost when my computer crashed, so I don't have the numbers off the top of my head). Plus, because the testicle isn't easily accessible the chances of CATCHING the cancer in time to make it easy to remove is very SMALL. The odds don't increase signfigantly till after the dog is 2 or so, but they do increase. Many vets will push for "NEUTER NOW OMG!!!!" but after doing some research I don't see any need to neuter EARLY in those cases (one huge exception, toy breeds, something about the tiny tinys changes the numbers and they should be neutered by 1yr if they have an undecended testicle). After poking around the numbers a bit it looks like the best thing IMO is to neuter once the dog is mature, but before "middle age", to reduce the chances of testicular cancer, and also keep the risks of other cancers from going up.
 

DMikeM

Well-Known Member
So I'm gonna add a question here for info's sake. Most of you know Boone has an undescended testicle, which the vet can't find right now. The advice I've received is to get him neutered once he's neuterable age (I'm waiting till he's at least two) but not wait too long after that as he could get testicular cancer. Are you saying that if I don't get him neutered, his chances of some kind of cancer are LOWER than if I do get him snipped?

Just have the vet remove the one that didn't come down. No reason to remove them both and it will give the dog the needed hormones to develop properly.
 

Robtouw

Well-Known Member
My boy is intact and will remain so. I no longer explain my choice and get asked quite often when I will neuter. My vet knows me well enough not to ask and so does her staff, but at the last Dog Wash fundraiser one of the guys that was shampooing the boys pointed out that I should neuter him (as though I missed Cruiser's boys hanging in the rear) and I simply asked him if he were neutered and if not when would that surgery be scheduled. I got a nasty look, but he shut up! :lolbangtable: I've had dogs my entire life from birth to now and have yet to cause an "accidental" pregnancy. It isn't too difficult to be a responsible dog owner, just takes a bit of effort.
 

Catia

Well-Known Member
added to the above is not only a vet willing to do it, but a vet who understands HOW. You don't want some unexperienced surgeon.

It is much more complicated to remove 1 testicle & leave the other intact properly than it is to do a full castration, & much more risk at something skrewing up.
 

ruthcatrin

Well-Known Member
the one testicle isn't in the scrotum, so that at least isn't a problem. Actually the big issue with an undecended testicle is making sure the vet gets ALL of it. If they don't get all the tesitulcar tissue, or can't find it at all, the risk for cancer remains. Arty had one that wasn't decended, so I spent way to long looking into the whole mess....
 

NeSaxena

Well-Known Member
Thanks for all the great advice! I'm gonna check if the vet can remove ALL of just the one that's missing, once Boone's all growed up :)
 

KristinandCianna

Well-Known Member
I usually just say, how do you think neutering your young child would effect his growth and development? Lol. These type people drive me NUTS. My vet has always said don't neuter until your dog is 2 so they have all of their hormones to help their orthopedic structures to come in as strong as possible. We usually agree to disagree. Most people just go ahead and go and spay or neuter their dogs. I work for a pet trainer, we get these questions all of the time, we tell people our opinion, most just don't listen, but some do. I've not had any big disagreements with anyone really on spay and neuter. We mostly just agree to disagree. Now, the ear crop, thats a whole different story lol
 

KristinandCianna

Well-Known Member
Oh, and Cianna is only spayed because she had pyo, I didn't really have a choice, plus I did not buy her to breed, so I wasn't going to risk her health just to keep her intact. If she hadn't gotten pyo, I would have kept her intact for awhile
 

Gunny

Well-Known Member
If some busy body know-it-all started lecturing me on neutering Gunny, and that they were pro-neutering all dogs at __ months, I would kindly let them know that I'm pro-stfu and mind your own damn business.
 

thelady_v2010

Well-Known Member
If some busy body know-it-all started lecturing me on neutering Gunny, and that they were pro-neutering all dogs at __ months, I would kindly let them know that I'm pro-stfu and mind your own damn business.

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