Vet appointment results. The good AND the bad.

[mountainfila]

Hey Swanguy, I wasnt quarreling with Kris, I was trying to help her, not fight with her. The internet is very impersonal and some things get lost in translation. And I am a she not a he and have lived with a large pack of dogs my whole life, and what may I ask did you find humorous in my replys?? Dogs are easy to control its the humans that are the problem, we have to many emotional issues and when we have an off day the dogs can sense it and take advantage, my dogs did it to me today, I wasn't in a good state of mind when I took them for a walk and I ran into all the things you don't want to run into with a fila lol, people that want to stop an chat and off leash dogs with inconsiderate owners, they saw me with a couple of huge dogs but proceeded to let theres out of their vehicle with not leash and they came straight for us, I advanced on the dog and yelled at the owners and the dog backed off. My dogs almost sent me on my ass cause I lost my shit at the people with the loose dogs and after that my dogs would not behave or listen to me, not a good day.

 

[swanguy7]

Hey Swanguy, I wasnt quarreling with Kris, I was trying to help her, not fight with her. The internet is very impersonal and some things get lost in translation. And I am a she not a he and have lived with a large pack of dogs my whole life, and what may I ask did you find humorous in my replys?? Dogs are easy to control its the humans that are the problem, we have to many emotional issues and when we have an off day the dogs can sense it and take advantage, my dogs did it to me today, I wasn't in a good state of mind when I took them for a walk and I ran into all the things you don't want to run into with a fila lol, people that want to stop an chat and off leash dogs with inconsiderate owners, they saw me with a couple of huge dogs but proceeded to let theres out of their vehicle with not leash and they came straight for us, I advanced on the dog and yelled at the owners and the dog backed off. My dogs almost sent me on my ass cause I lost my shit at the people with the loose dogs and after that my dogs would not behave or listen to me, not a good day.

Hey mate no not thinking anything was funny in what u what u were actually saying (advice etc) it all makes sense as does kris all good there . I just thought maybe you hadn't read all the previous post which I had and I saw funny side of your apology in my weird sense of humour . Like u apologised than continued your original point kinda again and to the point but I had read all previous post so when I came across yours earlier I expecting kris to be fairly responsive . Basically you said everything I would believe to be correct but I new kris new all this and ahh to hard to explain mate lol. Yep I know it's hard work trying to pull mastiffs back once there fired up they can be stubborn !! Must of sent u in bit of a worry hoping those Dogs would stop! Unfortunately I've been there about 3 times myself with my bm and this young guy at the beach had a pitbull (not saying anything bad about them lol I didn't know much about them apart from the media etc at the time and now I'm better educated on them from these forums etc ) but of course I was watching it with my 9 month old bullmastiff pup chasing a ball . Anyway my bm halo was running flat out with the ball n pitbull chasing when halo accidently clipt the owner of pit and sent him in the air and flat on his back ( wish I had a camera it was actually bit funny to c n he was ok ) but the pit thAn just gave my pup a nip to say hey watch yourself ' but than yes my dog !!! halo went crazy and no matter how many times me and the over guy tried pull her off she would just keep coming back I ended up having hold her with everything I had ! And I didn't have much left lol was all adrenaline . Anyway now she Is only ever on the leed as a result . But till this day I'm very cautious of other dogs coming to close I mean they are a guardian breed etc

 

[swanguy7]

Hey Swanguy, I wasnt quarreling with Kris, I was trying to help her, not fight with her. The internet is very impersonal and some things get lost in translation. And I am a she not a he and have lived with a large pack of dogs my whole life, and what may I ask did you find humorous in my replys?? Dogs are easy to control its the humans that are the problem, we have to many emotional issues and when we have an off day the dogs can sense it and take advantage, my dogs did it to me today, I wasn't in a good state of mind when I took them for a walk and I ran into all the things you don't want to run into with a fila lol, people that want to stop an chat and off leash dogs with inconsiderate owners, they saw me with a couple of huge dogs but proceeded to let theres out of their vehicle with not leash and they came straight for us, I advanced on the dog and yelled at the owners and the dog backed off. My dogs almost sent me on my ass cause I lost my shit at the people with the loose dogs and after that my dogs would not behave or listen to me, not a good day.

Oo lol sorry just realised you are are she not a he forgive me ;-) think I've been calling you mate etc whoops

 

[powergc]

Sorry to hear of your trouble, Kris.

Whatever the outcome, we all know (and you know) that you will do what is going to be best for Ruger in the long run. The first sedation will be super stressful... but just know that we are all here for you!

Best of luck with your big, handsome boy!

 

[Rugers-Kris]

Thank you so much.

Sorry to hear of your trouble, Kris.

Whatever the outcome, we all know (and you know) that you will do what is going to be best for Ruger in the long run. The first sedation will be super stressful... but just know that we are all here for you!

Best of luck with your big, handsome boy!

 

[cinnamon roll]

Damn, you just need to go to vet school and take care of that handsome English fila!! lol

Hang in there lets pray the sedative works for him.

 

[ParentsofVegas]

Here is my take FWIW:
And I speak from experience, as Bear in some ways, is of very similar temperament to Ruger.
He has that same "Space Bubble" attitude toward non family, and so
the Vet visits were full of tension. I understand as well what Mountain Fila
is trying to explain about reinforcing that guarding behavior contributing
to the issue. We are fairly certain that his temperament was encouraged by
his first owner. Our feeling was that a dog as big as Bear needed to be
more mellow and with the help of our trainers we have made a lot of
progress in getting him to be better behaved and less Guard y.
And this was achieved by training him that it was NOT OK to be that way.
Previously we had been just managing his space, now we are teaching
him that he does not own the space and must yield and look to us for
direction and orders on whats expected of him.
He is going to continue with this trainer to also undergo personal protection
training as well. As my trainer explained he has that instinct, We want to make sure
he has a "on" and "off".
Not a right or wrong thing, just personal preference.
Even with his progress and the many social visits we have
made to the vets office, He Will still be sedated and muzzled.
Why?
Because I want my Vet to be totally at ease when she works with
any of my animals. I would feel terrible if she missed something
because of her understandable fear of me not being able to control him.
Like most things, it comes down to weighing the risks and benefits.
Good luck Friday Kris. Don't feel bad about putting him under.
He will get a much better exam and you will be more confident of his overall health.

 

[Rugers-Kris]

I appreciate the advice. It is a very hard decision for me to make. I will assume that although Bear has some space issues there are some very big differences between the two since you were able to go and rescue/adopt him without getting your face torn off. The only way that would work for Ruger (Not that I would ever rehome him) is if I introduced him to the new person every day in his home and worked with him for an extended period and then he MIGHT accept a new person but maybe not.

The reason the vets office won't do it without him being sedated is because it is quite a liability. We have had successful visits (successful in that he is muzzled and I hold him and they do what has to be done as quick as possible and we are out of there) but he has gotten much bigger, obviously stronger and more mature and the "What ifs" seem to be more prevalent now. As I said before, I do understand that.

I am going to do it this way and remind myself that he will be able to have an awesome check up on his whole body (to include his head) and I would like to do that just to be assured that all is well.

Thank you again for responding. It is so nice to have this group of Mastiff Lovers to vent/talk to about stuff that other folks may not understand or at least not take as seriously as we do.

 

[ParentsofVegas]

To be honest, I did have some fear of him then, and have no doubt that without
the major intervention of our present trainer he would be totally unapproachable by now.
Luckily, He was re-homed to us at about ten months of age by a former owner,
Who was not able to take him, but recognized the need to remove him from a bad home.
He did work with us for a while just to get him into a semi acceptance, but it was still
pretty dicey for the first month. Also the over the top guard behavior only got more
hard core as he became more bonded to us and also passed through that 10 - 14 month
age where it is typical for them to first show their adult temperament. If we
had not gotten him at that 10 month mark he would have been just as you describe:
Looking to take a face off. He more than demonstrated his willingness to do that
at his first vet appt, which is the major reason for a new vet.
Thank goodness he is not quite as big as your guy.
Ill be thinking positive thoughts your way on Friday and hope all goes smooth.
Also if you don't mind I would much appreciate your feedback on what
sedation protocol was used and what you think about it after.
Our Vet visit is looming down the road.

 

[Rugers-Kris]

Thanks. His appointment is this Friday and I will give the details when we are done.

To be honest, I did have some fear of him then, and have no doubt that without
the major intervention of our present trainer he would be totally unapproachable by now.
Luckily, He was re-homed to us at about ten months of age by a former owner,
Who was not able to take him, but recognized the need to remove him from a bad home.
He did work with us for a while just to get him into a semi acceptance, but it was still
pretty dicey for the first month. Also the over the top guard behavior only got more
hard core as he became more bonded to us and also passed through that 10 - 14 month
age where it is typical for them to first show their adult temperament. If we
had not gotten him at that 10 month mark he would have been just as you describe:
Looking to take a face off. He more than demonstrated his willingness to do that
at his first vet appt, which is the major reason for a new vet.
Thank goodness he is not quite as big as your guy.
Ill be thinking positive thoughts your way on Friday and hope all goes smooth.
Also if you don't mind I would much appreciate your feedback on what
sedation protocol was used and what you think about it after.
Our Vet visit is looming down the road.

 

[Mag-Pie]

I know I'm a bit late to the party, and just now catching up on the reading. But I'm sorry to hear that the vet visit didn't go well, I know from your previous post that you were dreading this and have hoped to never have to go down this rout. Thank you for this update, this thread is also very informative and reading through your experience and everyone else's gives a lot to think about. Also, the speculation about the cause of Ruger's behavior that mountainfila made was very interesting, even if contentious, and as swanguy7 already pointed out the “apology†shared the same sentiment as the original point that was made; and I also found it humorous, not so much as to what was said but how. Must be my F'd up sense of humor, or lack thereof. Either way, I've been reading everything you've stated, you seem to have a good idea of what you are doing and what needs to be done, yet I understand your concerns also. But I also think that ParentsofVegas made a good point about training. And that is, in fact, what I am trying to work on with my trainer since my CC has that “space bubble†attitude towards strangers also. Of course, I have no idea whether he is as extreme as Ruger is or not, although I did see him get pretty extreme the first night he was at my house when my SO came home from work… and that took some serious time and effort to work through, and to get him accepting of my SO. IDK why Luther from the beginning had no problem with me, and seemed to like me, but I like to think we are soul-mates, LOL. All dogs are different, as essentially all people are and their methods. At our best, we all do what works for us, or at least try. Our vet visit will be in the near future, and your experience is helping me prepare and consider all the options. Good luck Friday Kris! Best wishes! And please update on how it went, I would also much appreciate it.

 

[swanguy7]

I know I'm a bit late to the party, and just now catching up on the reading. But I'm sorry to hear that the vet visit didn't go well, I know from your previous post that you were dreading this and have hoped to never have to go down this rout. Thank you for this update, this thread is also very informative and reading through your experience and everyone else's gives a lot to think about. Also, the speculation about the cause of Ruger's behavior that mountainfila made was very interesting, even if contentious, and as swanguy7 already pointed out the “apology†shared the same sentiment as the original point that was made; and I also found it humorous, not so much as to what was said but how. Must be my F'd up sense of humor, or lack thereof. Either way, I've been reading everything you've stated, you seem to have a good idea of what you are doing and what needs to be done, yet I understand your concerns also. But I also think that ParentsofVegas made a good point about training. And that is, in fact, what I am trying to work on with my trainer since my CC has that “space bubble†attitude towards strangers also. Of course, I have no idea whether he is as extreme as Ruger is or not, although I did see him get pretty extreme the first night he was at my house when my SO came home from work… and that took some serious time and effort to work through, and to get him accepting of my SO. IDK why Luther from the beginning had no problem with me, and seemed to like me, but I like to think we are soul-mates, LOL. All dogs are different, as essentially all people are and their methods. At our best, we all do what works for us, or at least try. Our vet visit will be in the near future, and your experience is helping me prepare and consider all the options. Good luck Friday Kris! Best wishes! And please update on how it went, I would also much appreciate it.

Funny see we must both share same silly humour lol . I think rugar is seeing the vet 2mrw? I would be interested to see how it went . GOODLUCK

 

[Rugers-Kris]

I haven't been on a lot lately but it sounds like you you got your boy as an older pup? I think that changes things a lot as there is normally either come unknown history or some negative history that comes with them. It breaks my heart because I am a forever person. If I bring them home, no matter what happens....they will be there for their entire lives. Also, I have found that more times than not, most of what people see with their dogs is fear aggression which is very different from protectiveness. I am not saying that is what is going on with your boy but just that you have to investigate to see what it is that you are dealing with because the way to handle each is very different in my opinion. Being that I am the crazy dog lady, I would agree that the two of you are soulmates. I am a believer! Thank you for the well wishes. I will update after the appointment. I have never been so nervous. I can travel all over with a giant protective beast without issue but the idea of putting him under has me scared to death. LOL

I know I'm a bit late to the party, and just now catching up on the reading. But I'm sorry to hear that the vet visit didn't go well, I know from your previous post that you were dreading this and have hoped to never have to go down this rout. Thank you for this update, this thread is also very informative and reading through your experience and everyone else's gives a lot to think about. Also, the speculation about the cause of Ruger's behavior that mountainfila made was very interesting, even if contentious, and as swanguy7 already pointed out the “apology” shared the same sentiment as the original point that was made; and I also found it humorous, not so much as to what was said but how. Must be my F'd up sense of humor, or lack thereof. Either way, I've been reading everything you've stated, you seem to have a good idea of what you are doing and what needs to be done, yet I understand your concerns also. But I also think that ParentsofVegas made a good point about training. And that is, in fact, what I am trying to work on with my trainer since my CC has that “space bubble” attitude towards strangers also. Of course, I have no idea whether he is as extreme as Ruger is or not, although I did see him get pretty extreme the first night he was at my house when my SO came home from work… and that took some serious time and effort to work through, and to get him accepting of my SO. IDK why Luther from the beginning had no problem with me, and seemed to like me, but I like to think we are soul-mates, LOL. All dogs are different, as essentially all people are and their methods. At our best, we all do what works for us, or at least try. Our vet visit will be in the near future, and your experience is helping me prepare and consider all the options. Good luck Friday Kris! Best wishes! And please update on how it went, I would also much appreciate it.

Yes, his appointment is tomorrow morning and I will certainly update on how it goes.

Funny see we must both share same silly humour lol . I think rugar is seeing the vet 2mrw? I would be interested to see how it went . GOODLUCK

 

[swanguy7]

I haven't been on a lot lately but it sounds like you you got your boy as an older pup? I think that changes things a lot as there is normally either come unknown history or some negative history that comes with them. It breaks my heart because I am a forever person. If I bring them home, no matter what happens....they will be there for their entire lives. Also, I have found that more times than not, most of what people see with their dogs is fear aggression which is very different from protectiveness. I am not saying that is what is going on with your boy but just that you have to investigate to see what it is that you are dealing with because the way to handle each is very different in my opinion. Being that I am the crazy dog lady, I would agree that the two of you are soulmates. I am a believer! Thank you for the well wishes. I will update after the appointment. I have never been so nervous. I can travel all over with a giant protective beast without issue but the idea of putting him under has me scared to death. LOL

Yes, his appointment is tomorrow morning and I will certainly update on how it goes.

Thanks I'll be interested to know how it goes ;-) hopefully all good

 

[Jakesmum]

Good luck tomorrow with Ruger's appointment. I feel for you and your worry at having to sedate him. It is one of my biggest concerns, when I had Jake neutered at 18 months I was a wreck until they called to say he was awake and doing well, then I cried with absolute relief (still makes me want to cry and that was over a year and a half ago). As it has been said, vets are using better drugs nowadays and have a better understanding on their effect on different animals. I will be looking for an update tomorrow on how it all went. Sending positive thoughts your way!

 

[CeeCee]

Kris, I'm so sorry. I know exactly what you are talking about. Zeek has space bubbles as well and as long as you ignore him and don't try to touch him (as a stranger right off the bat) he's fine to share 3 or 4 feet of space with you. However, all bets are off when it comes to the vet. Like Ruger he's fine in the lobby and he will even let the Vet Tech's take his blood or give him shots, but when the vets come in the exam room - he goes to A WHOLE NEW LEVEL OF SERIOUS -head down, hard stare, a looow, deeeep growl. My vets have commended me on my ability to handle Zeek, but it is a lot of pressure on me the handler and it is even more stress on Zeek. (Zeek is also muzzled.)

I'm in the process of looking for a new vet - one who has a more relaxing personal and environmental vibe - in hopes that we will not need to go the sedation route. (I really thing a part of it is energy in the whole office.)

I'm sending positive, relaxing vibes to you and Ruger! Let us know how it goes.

 

[Rugers-Kris]

Thank you so much! I just want it to be over with.

Good luck tomorrow with Ruger's appointment. I feel for you and your worry at having to sedate him. It is one of my biggest concerns, when I had Jake neutered at 18 months I was a wreck until they called to say he was awake and doing well, then I cried with absolute relief (still makes me want to cry and that was over a year and a half ago). As it has been said, vets are using better drugs nowadays and have a better understanding on their effect on different animals. I will be looking for an update tomorrow on how it all went. Sending positive thoughts your way!

 

[Rugers-Kris]

Thank You. I have changed vets several time for different reasons and I am trying not to at this point as I am very happy with them as a whole and they finally got all of Magnum's issues under control and the amount of knowledge that they have about Mastiff's is amazing........I just feel like the whole vet experience is a catch 22. Sigh

Kris, I'm so sorry. I know exactly what you are talking about. Zeek has space bubbles as well and as long as you ignore him and don't try to touch him (as a stranger right off the bat) he's fine to share 3 or 4 feet of space with you. However, all bets are off when it comes to the vet. Like Ruger he's fine in the lobby and he will even let the Vet Tech's take his blood or give him shots, but when the vets come in the exam room - he goes to A WHOLE NEW LEVEL OF SERIOUS -head down, hard stare, a looow, deeeep growl. My vets have commended me on my ability to handle Zeek, but it is a lot of pressure on me the handler and it is even more stress on Zeek. (Zeek is also muzzled.)

I'm in the process of looking for a new vet - one who has a more relaxing personal and environmental vibe - in hopes that we will not need to go the sedation route. (I really thing a part of it is energy in the whole office.)

I'm sending positive, relaxing vibes to you and Ruger! Let us know how it goes.

 

[musicdeb]

Titan see a new vet on 9/3, hopefully this one will not be afraid of him. I'm going to try something new, I'm going to let the tech take him in to see the vet without me and see if that makes a difference. He will be wearing his muzzle. I'll go into the room once the exam is over and see if Titan's demeanor changes.

This vet is highly praised and he works with the humane society to take care of the pets. I've taken pets from the humane society to see him.

When I made the appointment, I told them Titan did not like men and asked if the vet was afraid of dogs. They said he wasn't afraid of any dog that has come in to the office.

Hope this works!

 

[Rugers-Kris]

Good luck, Deb. I hope it works out for you. I am so paranoid that I can't even imagine letting my dogs go back without me but it wouldn't be an option with Ruger anyway as if someone reached for his leash, that would be it for him. Honestly, I don't think Magnum would go. He loves going to the vet and he loves EVERYBODY but if they tried to take him without out me he would lay down or pull like crazy to get back to me I think.

Titan see a new vet on 9/3, hopefully this one will not be afraid of him. I'm going to try something new, I'm going to let the tech take him in to see the vet without me and see if that makes a difference. He will be wearing his muzzle. I'll go into the room once the exam is over and see if Titan's demeanor changes.

This vet is highly praised and he works with the humane society to take care of the pets. I've taken pets from the humane society to see him.

When I made the appointment, I told them Titan did not like men and asked if the vet was afraid of dogs. They said he wasn't afraid of any dog that has come in to the office.

Hope this works!