Should we Stud out our dog?

[ruthcatrin]

I'm getting ready to clean house on this thread if you guys can't somewhat stay on topic.

Spoilsport

 

[afidz]

To get this back on track. ..
The mothers name is Minnie (she belongs to the other breeder) and the father is Luke (the historian)
I sent her a email asking her for that information, shes always keep to respond.
In the contract it states that she gets the puppies hips and joints OFA certified. Also it says that if our vet finds anything wrong with him we can return him no questions asked. There is also a 2 year guarantee on their hips and joints provided that we monitor weight gain. We are planning on going straight from the breeder to our vet. We have already spoken to her and she said she was going to give a comprehensive exam.to ensure we are getting a healthy dog

 

[angelbears]

Spoilsport

He's only talking to the guys. No need to worry! LOL

I'm done AK. Unless I'm pulled back in. *shrub* *wenk*

 

[ruthcatrin]

To get this back on track. ..
The mothers name is Minnie (she belongs to the other breeder) and the father is Luke (the historian)
I sent her a email asking her for that information, shes always keep to respond.
In the contract it states that she gets the puppies hips and joints OFA certified. Also it says that if our vet finds anything wrong with him we can return him no questions asked. There is also a 2 year guarantee on their hips and joints provided that we monitor weight gain. We are planning on going straight from the breeder to our vet. We have already spoken to her and she said she was going to give a comprehensive exam.to ensure we are getting a healthy dog

I'll give you the standard warning that most of the health testing, including official OFA hip/elbow certs can't be done until after the dog turns two, so I've always kinda considered the 2yr health guarantee useless. But I'm glad she's highly responsive to you!

 

[angelbears]

Most guarantees require that you return the dog. Think about that for a minute. Most genetic problems are not going to show up at first. When/if a problem shows up 6 months or a year later, are you really going to send the dog back?

Also, I don't believe that you can get the hips certified that young.

 

[afidz]

I have to look at the contract and see what exactly it says about the tests done, I may be mistaken. I'm not home right now so it's not in front of me. I could be misstating something.

 

[ruthcatrin]

*rolls eyes at Laura* Speaking of hijacking and an inability to cope.....

The return to breeder if the initial vet visit finds something is standard, and AB's right thats heartbreaking enough. The various and sundry health tests referred to earlier in this thread aren't (mostly) things that are going to be caught in that first vet visit. Very few hip problems are caught before the dog turns 1, and not many more between the ages of 1 and 2 for example. Definitely check the wording of the health guarantee and what is expected if something does happen. If your only options are to return to breeder or cope by yourself, well, picture giving up your dog after you've had him for a year and a half.....and ask Smokeycat what she spent (or would have without insurance) on Kryten's elbow dysplaysia surgery. Ideally I'd want to see a breeder who WILL take back the dog if you can't cope, but who'll also help you cope with a diagnosis that is financially painfull and that might have been avoided if they'd ensured that their dogs and dog's parents had been tested.

 

[WalnutCrest]

Is the deposit refundable?

The parents should be CH's, and if not, then the grandparents should be CH's. One CH'd animal in a LARGE kennel doesn't really tell me much (other than they don't want to spend the money to see how their animals compare to other peoples and/or they know how they stack up and it's not a good sign). The list of breeders I'd buy a pup from (or semen for a breeding) who do not test or show their dogs is VERY short (and this particular person is not on that list).

Glad to hear her contract states that if there is an issue, the pups come back to her. Good breeders do that. Good for her.

Regarding your comments on the merger ... do they also share the costs if there is a "loss" on a litter? What about costs for testing? Do they ever use outside studs? If not, why not? It's VERY rare that a breeder will have both 'the best male' and 'the best female'.

...there is more...but it'll have to wait.

Read the standard and watch the Old School Mastiffs videos on youtube and get back to me/us.

 

[afidz]

Did one of you send me a private message? I don't want to download anything to my computer.
The breeder got back to me with a whole family tree and 2 other documents that I haven't opened yet. What is the best way to share those with you ?

 

[afidz]

I don't think she has Minnie registered yet, when I talked to her last week she mentioned that she had been meaning to do something with her and life got crazy (not an excuse, not defending, just telling you what she told me)
Wrighteous Luke the Historian is not a champion himself, but a lot of his kin are. I do have his registration number
I have Minnie's sire and dam's lineage, I just don't really know what to look for in that
Along with the documents she sent me, she also said:
"I know most of the dogs on all three pedigrees or have at least met most..Mountain oaks Mastiffs in Captains pedigree is where they got the mastiff Gunner for the Movie The Sandlot..Purdy Minnies mom is a half sister to My Major who passed away a few yrs ago., Purdy herself passed just 3 months ago of pyrometreia a severe uterine infection that went undiagnosed. "

So...my dog is related to "the Beast"???

 

[afidz]

I misspoke, Minnie is registered, she doesn't own her so she does't have her documents. But her registration number is WS38038710

 

[ruthcatrin]

I'll note that I can't find either Minnie or Luke in the OFA database. Hips can be done Pennhip, which isn't searchable, but everything else should be in the OFA database.

I did not send you a PM previous, but am about to.

 

[WalnutCrest]

Did she lease Minnie from her owner?

Presumably so.

If the paperwork isn't pristine, there can be a problem with registering the pups (like I'd the bitch owner refuses to sign of on the litter, etc.).

Leasing a bitch is not unheard of by and between reputable breeders, but it's pretty rare and only done for a very specific purpose.

Oh, and I'd rather hear your thoughts, questions and comments about the breed standard and those videos I suggested than some dog in a movie.

 

[afidz]

Minnie belongs to the other breeder that she merged with. She came and lived at her faculty. Terri told me today that she just got the pups registration.
I honestly haven't had time or energy to sit on my computer and watch out read anything. Sitting is very painful at the moment so I've been researching what I can on my phone. Some websites are very difficult to navigate from my phone. I have full intentions of reading it though. I should start feeling better soon

The Sandlot is one of my favorite child hood movies, maybe no one else cares, but I think it's pretty cool that my dog is related. It's a fun bit of information

 

[afidz]

I went onto the AKC website and read the standard there. A lot of what was listed were things I have already read in books I've purchased or research I've done online.
I know it's important to socialize him right away, as well as talking him in public to get him used to loud noises and and crowds. But should we give him time to settle into our home fora week or so before we start that? I don't want to overload his senses and stress him out.
And speaking of bringing him home, I am glad it was mentioned to me to get a stuffed animal for him to cuddle with, I don't think I would of thought of that. What are some other things I can do to make him comfortable? I think I read somewhere on here that he probably won't eat at first, is there something I can do to encourage him to eat? How long until I should start to worry?

 

[Sadies Mom]

Did one of you send me a private message? I don't want to download anything to my computer.
The breeder got back to me with a whole family tree and 2 other documents that I haven't opened yet. What is the best way to share those with you ?

I sent you a pm

 

[Sadies Mom]

I went onto the AKC website and read the standard there. A lot of what was listed were things I have already read in books I've purchased or research I've done online.
I know it's important to socialize him right away, as well as talking him in public to get him used to loud noises and and crowds. But should we give him time to settle into our home fora week or so before we start that? I don't want to overload his senses and stress him out.
And speaking of bringing him home, I am glad it was mentioned to me to get a stuffed animal for him to cuddle with, I don't think I would of thought of that. What are some other things I can do to make him comfortable? I think I read somewhere on here that he probably won't eat at first, is there something I can do to encourage him to eat? How long until I should start to worry?

Yes, socialization is very important, but make sure he has at least the second set of shots until you take him out to public places. You do not want him to get sick. Start obedience training immediately, get him used to a collar and leash. Keep him on the same food that the breeder have him on for a while (2-3 weeks) and then you can slowly switch food if you want to. He may or may not be "depressed" at first. My Sadie settled right in, no issue with eating or drinking and she came from a big litter (she has 12 siblings). If you have not bought one yet, invest in a crate and crate train him from the very beginning.

 

[WalnutCrest]

Apparently, you've already started to worry. Keep reading and asking questions. You'll be a better pet owner as time goes by.

If she is going to kennel train them before they go home, send her a recently worn shirt of yours for him to sleep with ... he will recognize your scent that way.

When you say you read the breed standard, what did you read? The item I provided the link to was the standard. It discusses how a Mastiff should look, move and behave.

 

[afidz]

I read the breed standard on here as well as on the AKC website. I don't think she starts create training, but I will ask. She did mention that she starts very basic obedience training to lay the ground work and set us up for success. She takes obedience very seriously, it's even part of the contract.

 

[Kujo]

I'll bite...

I just read this thread from to start to finish. From a fresh readers stand point, someone who hasn't been following this thread from day one, I can see why afidz felt attacked in the beginning. Several initial comments were very condescending...I know we've all seen these posts before and it can get a little tedious explaining things in a polite way when you are saying the same thing over and over again, but try! Don't assume right off the bat that the op you are responding to is just in it for the $, or in it because they just want to try breeding once, or are being trolls and just trying to rile everyone up. Making these kinds of assumptions is extremely rude and is very off putting. Being to the point or blunt is one thing...but correcting spelling and pointing out all the potential negatives of a situation is just petty. How do you know if english ins't their first language? How do you know if they haven't already discussed all the potential negatives with their breeder, or even thought about it themselves? YOU DON'T. So don't make assumptions...or if you just can't help it try and assume that the op you are responding to is just another mastiff-lover seeking information and help about their breed (plenty of time to make real judgements later once you have a better feel for who they are). I was happy to see the end result of this thread was far more amiable, lets try and start future threads like the ending of this one, everyone deserves the benefit of the doubt. and here's a disclaimer to all the 'potential' comments coming my way for this: if u respund deffensivley...u prety mutch just addmited to bein in tha rong.

Now for my actual comment to the OP...I know I'm really late to this thread and you've already made the decision to not breed, but here's what I would have said if I had the chance:

WHY do you want to breed? (Why is incredibly important IMO). And you've said it yourself you are very knew to this and really don't know much about breeding...so maybe this isn't the right dog to learn on, love your new pet and do some research and make a more informed decision later on to see if breeding is really for you. Personally...I think it's a whole lot of responsibilty and $$, I'd rather let a breeder take care of all that and just be a knowledgable pet owner. But that's just me.

Yes, you want to avoid any strenuous exercise for the first year, too much stress on growing joints can be terrible for a mastiff puppy. Generally for the first couple months the pup will get all the exercise it needs by just being a puppy. And training is a wonderful way to exercise too, just learning the vocabulary sit, stay, lay down, etc. can wear a puppy out. I haven't built a car ramp, but we did build a ramp for our stairs for my boy. However you make it, ot buy it, make sure it's got a high weight limit Another common saying on here is "never walk a mastiff further than you can carry them home". At first you wont want to go on any walks longer than 5-10 minutes, and if you live in a hot climate, I doubt your mastiff will even want to go on walks lol. They don't tolerate heat very well at all (short snout makes it harder for them to cool themselves down). Toys....I wouldn't worry too much...but if you end up with "one of those puppies" that likes to destroy and eat anything it touches, you probably want to get bigger toys. And please...no rawhyde, I just hate the stuff. My boy puked up a whole piece once, scared the shit out of me. If you live a social life then you'll want a social dog, take him lots of places when he's young (just not long walks, prepare to post up somewhere for a while so he can see how the world works). If you have friends with dogs, that's the best way to socialize him with other dogs; it's controlled and you're around people you know and trust. I don't do crate training, but it's highly recommended on here. Raw diet is the best, but there are high quality kibble options as well, if you go kibble try to avoid grains and chicken (common allergy among mastiffs). Don't neuter until at least 18 months old, this way your boy can grow naturally. That's about all I have off the top of my head, plenty of good advice and resources on this forum, keep the questions coming and you'll keep getting answers. (note: I've had my Kujo since 3 months old, he's now almost 2 years old, 90% of what I've learned I've learned from this forum)

You ever hear the saying you can judge a lot about a person by what kind of dog they have? Well mastiffs are very stubborn dogs, so that gives you an idea as to why everyone gives such bull-headed answers p). But mastiffs are also fiercely loyal and loving to their people. The group of people on this forum are very loyal and helpful to one another, you'd be astounded to see us join forces and help an individual in need. It's more of a community then a forum. I hope you stick around to see that

AND you better post pictures of your puppy when he's home...all this build up REQUIRES cute puppy pictures

...sorry for the long post.